Date: Mon, 11 Apr 2011 05:37:57 GMT -------------- BEGIN bread-bakers.v111.n015 -------------- 001 - Mike Avery Subject: Re: chemical smelling starter Date: Sun, 03 Apr 2011 12:47:54 -0500 On 3/27/2011 6:23 PM, Jim Shaw wrote: >Since then I have tried to get a new starter going. I have followed >specific directions from several books as well as just following >common sense and leaving flour and water to ferment - feed it etc. > >Each time I have ended up with a starter that bubbles along nicely >but has a distinctly chemical - organic solvent sort of smell. Not >the clean yeasty smell I had before. I have never had problems like >this in the years I have been making bread. I don't think the new kitchen furnishings are an issue. There are lots of contradictory sets of advice online about starting starters. And while I am sure that all of them worked for the people who wrote them, in some cases I suspect they worked by luck more than skill. The smell you talked about is an indication that your starter is not good. Some bacteria have the ability to eat protein. They usually cause an acetone/cheap fingernail polish type smell. Starters usually develop this ability when they aren't fed enough - that's when the bacteria that can eat protein have a survival advantage over those that can't. Once a starter does this, it is best discarded. It is almost impossible to weed those bacteria out of the culture. A number of experts have told me when your starter does that, just discard it and start over. My experience suggests they are right. My first suggestion is to get a known good starter from a friend or baker who uses sourdough. It's fast, easy and reliable. I don't know who would ship to New Zealand, but you might check with Sourdoughs International Northwest Sourdough King Arthur flour (their Yankee sourdough starter only) or one of my favorites: the Carl Griffith 1847 Oregon Trail sourdough starter distributed at no cost by the Friends of Carl (their website is up again). While all they ask for their starter is that you include a stamped self-addressed envelope, I encourage anyone using their starter to send them a couple of dollars (or more). They are good folks and it's a good starter. If you are really determined to start your own starter, here's what has worked for me. I detail it, and two other reliable methods, for starting a starter on my web page, Sourdough Home . First, you aren't catching the starter from the air. There are a lot more microorganisms on your flour than in the air. Next, you don't need, and shouldn't use, anything but flour and water. Grapes, cabbage leaves, yogurt, kefir and bakers yeast all have yeast on them, or contain lactobacillus bacteria. But in each case, it's the wrong yeast and the wrong bacteria. In the case of bakers yeast, bakers yeast can not survive in a healthy sourdough starter. You won't have a healthy sourdough starter until the starter kills off the critters from the grapes, cabbage leaves, etc. It's faster to just use flour and water. You'll enjoy the grapes, cabbage, kefir, and yogurt more than the culture anyway. And you can make better use of the yeast. (One book says a speck of yeast will help draw wild yeast to your culture. Yeast are not ducks, yeast goes where the wind blows them, they don't have the capacity to notice your speck of yeast and decide to settled down on your starter. Your flour - you want a flour that is described by as many of the following words as possible - fresh, stone ground, organic, and whole grain. You do not want flour that was ground in a micronizer, that was bleached, or that has been refined. All of those things reduce the number of microorganisms in the flour. A friend tells me he has never been able to start a starter with white flour. Either whole wheat or rye are good. I'd avoid gluten free flours at this point. Next, mix 1/4 cup water and 1/2 cup flour. Or about 50 grams of each. If you use cups, sift the flour, spoon it into the half cup measure, and scrape off the excess with a straight edge. You want a thick mixture - like a glazing compound. I usually mix this in a stainless steel bowl, though you can use a glass bowl if you prefer. The admonition about metal and sourdough is an old husbands tale and doesn't apply to stainless steel. Cover the bowl and set in a reasonably warm area. Say 65 to 85F or 18 to 30C. Cooler temperatures slow things down too much. Warmer tends to odd organisms taking over and giving you off tastes. To some extent, the organisms that take over your starter will be dependent on the temperature of your starter. However, you can get a good starter at any of these temperatures. Some people use pineapple juice instead of water. This makes the mix more acidic and prevents some bacteria from taking over. However, these bacteria won't survive in a mature starter, so I've always preferred to just drink the pineapple juice. Feel free to use pineapple juice, just make sure it is free of preservatives and things that might kill your starter. Now wait. After 12 hours, look at your starter. If it's not bubbling, wait 12 more hours. If it's still not bubbling, wait 12 more hours. If it's still not bubbling, give it 12 more hours. Once it bubbles, skip to the paragraph that starts, "it's bubbling!". If it hasn't bubbled after two days, you have a problem. I'd suggest trying a different brand of flour. If it still doesn't work, switch to a bottled spring water. Not a distilled water, you want the minerals. A very few tap waters don't work well with sourdough. It's bubbling! So, it's time to feed it. Add 1/4 cup of water and stir vigorously. Then add 1/2 cup of flour and stir that in. Cover and set aside. In 12 hours, it should be bubbling vigorously. If not, give it 12 more hours. Now, discard 1/2 the starter, add 1/4 cup of water, stir vigorously, and add 1/2 cup of flour and stir again. At this point, you'll do this every 12 hours. You want the starter to get to a point where it will reliably double in size between feedings. A digression - every sourdough starter feeding should be enough to at least double the size of the starter. If you don't double the starter size, you'll end up starving it. Imagine if you feed your Great Dane puppy half a cup of dog food every day. If you want him to grow up, you have to feed him more. Same with starter. You can't discard half a puppy, you can discard 1/2 the starter and keep it at a steady state. If you don't discard, in 10 days you'll have a swimming pool full of starter. A sourdough starter at room temperature should be fed twice a day. 12 hours is an approximation. If you stop off after work for a few pints and it's 18 hours since the last feeding, that's OK. People who don't feed their starter twice a day tend to be able to tell you how easy it is to start a starter. Once your starter stabilizes, you can set aside the starter you are taking out of the main starter and use it for other things. However, at this stage you don't really have a starter, you have a biology experiment and I don't think it's ready to be eaten. End of digression... Once your starter is reliably rising to twice it's size, it's time to wean it off whole grain flour and get it onto white flour. Overall, I find that white flour starters withstand abuse and neglect better than whole grain starters. It also helps refine the starter to the few microorganisms you want - every time you add more whole grain flour, you are adding a lot more microorganisms, and we want to encourage our friends and discourage their enemies. Biologically cleaner white flour helps at this point. So, over a period of 3 or 4 feedings add more and more white flour to the feeding until you are using all white flour. The starter will become thinner as white flour doesn't absorb as much water as a whole grain flour, and that's OK. So, first 10 or 12 grams white flour - or a tablespoon or so, and the rest of the half cup, or 50 grams should be whole wheat. The next time 25 grams white flour - or 1/4 cup, then about 35 or 40 grams white about 3/8 of a cup, and then all white. I prefer to not use a starter until it passes two tests. It must be able to double in size through rising between feedings, and it must be at least a week old. When you're ready to bake, just stop discarding half the starter at each feeding and double the starter's size at each feeding. You'll have enough to bake with in a hurry. Your starter will continue to mature for 30 to 90 days. After that, you can refrigerate it between uses. I talk about how to do this, and more, in the starter primer. As a side note, if you find you've used all the starter, I have a page on emergency starter rescue. Good luck, and please let me know how your new starter works out, whether by my approach or another, Mike *Bake With Mike * Mike Avery A Randomly Selected Bread Saying Of The Day: "Bread and water--these are the things nature requires. For such things no man is too poor, and whosoever can limit his desire to them alone can rival Jupiter for happiness." -Seneca --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v111.n015.2 --------------- From: Reggie Dwork Subject: The All-American Bread Basket Date: Sat, 09 Apr 2011 22:17:33 -0700 Info on the various types/shapes of bread. Reggie (Bread), The All-American Bread Basket Here's what's hot and fresh at country stores, city bake shops, and some supermarkets: BAGUETTE: a long, thin lad with diagonal slashes in the top crust. BATARDE: a medium-long loaf, wide in the center and tapered at the ends; also called a French loaf. BOULE: a round loaf of white bread; the name is French for "ball." CIABATTA: a flat, chewy choice with lots of holes in the dough and a flour-coated crust; the Italian name means "old slipper." FOCACCIA: flat Italian bread with a pebbly, dimpled top; may be plain or made with herbs, onions, or olives. FOUGASSE: a low, lattice-cut loaf originally made in the south of France and sometimes studded with Mediterranean ingredients like anchovies or olives. SEMOLINA BREAD: usually made with unbleached all-purpose flour and finely ground, unbleached patent durum flour, which gives the bread its characteristic pale-yellow color. Coarsely ground semolina flour, which has the texture of cornmeal and is used in pasta making, is traditionally dusted on the bread pans to prevent loaves from sticking. Source: "Good Housekeeping, Feb 1998" --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v111.n015.3 --------------- From: Reggie Dwork Subject: Orange-Rosemary Scones Date: Sat, 09 Apr 2011 22:20:35 -0700 * Exported from MasterCook * (Bread), Orange-Rosemary Scones Recipe By : Serving Size : 15 Preparation Time :0:30 Categories : Bread-Bakers Mailing List Breads/Muffins/Rolls Nuts Amount Measure Ingredient -- Preparation Method -------- ------------ -------------------------------- 2 cups all-purpose flour -- unbleached 1/4 cup sugar 1 tablespoon baking powder 1 teaspoon baking soda 1 pinch salt 1 cup plain yogurt 1/4 cup orange juice -- fresh 4 tablespoons unsalted butter -- melted 2 teaspoons orange zest -- finely grated 2 teaspoons rosemary -- minced 1/2 cup pistachio nut -- roasted, shelled, coarsely chopped fig jam -- or chutney, for serving plain yogurt -- for serving Preheat the oven to 375F and position 2 racks in the upper and lower thirds of the oven. Line two baking sheets with parchment paper. In a medium bowl, combine the flour with the sugar, baking powder, baking soda and salt. In a small bowl, combine the yogurt with the orange juice, butter, orange zest and rosemary. Add the yogurt mixture to the dry ingredients and stir just until evenly moisteded. Fold in the pistachios. Using a 1/4-cup measure, scoop the dough onto the prepared baking sheets. Bake the scones for about 16 minutes, or until golden on top. Serve warm or at room temperature with the fig chutney and yogurt. Start to Finish Time: "0:45" - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Per Serving (excluding unknown items): 139 Calories; 6g Fat (37.7% calories from fat); 3g Protein; 19g Carbohydrate; 1g Dietary Fiber; 10mg Cholesterol; 199mg Sodium. Exchanges: 1 Grain(Starch); 0 Lean Meat; 0 Fruit; 0 Non-Fat Milk; 1 Fat; 1/2 Other Carbohydrates. NOTES : The scones can be stored in an airtight container for up to 2 days. Rewarm in a 325F oven. --------------- END bread-bakers.v111.n015 --------------- Copyright (c) 1996-2011 Regina Dwork and Jeffrey Dwork All Rights Reserved