Date: Sun, 21 Oct 2007 10:44:15 GMT -------------- BEGIN bread-bakers.v107.n029 -------------- 001 - thecoach@paradise.net.nz - Sourdough help 002 - "STEPHEN BLUMM" Subject: Misting Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2007 15:29:34 -0400 In response to the post about buying a misting device, I had no luck with Misto products. I think I gave up after the third or so got hopelessly clogged. I did see a pump version in the King Arthur catalog for about $15 or so. I think the thing works by applying a little pressure rather than being under pressure. I think it is made in Germany but would not swear to its national origins. For spraying water I found that the garden products work much better than the kitchen ones. Completely unrelated, I have recently found that if I quickly sift rye flour it makes dough that is easier to work with and breads a bit less dense. I am referring to breads that are about 50% rye flour. My recent experience is entirely impressionistic and not tested! Stephen Blumm --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v107.n029.3 --------------- From: "Lorraine Hartley" Subject: Re: Electrolux Assistent Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2007 18:44:52 -0500 I have an Electrolux Assistent and having tried a few times to use the dough hook gave up on it completely and always use the plastic roller/scraper parts instead. I generally start off with the roller about 3/4 of the way in towards the center of the bowl and then as I gradually add more flour (you DID add your flour gradually, right??) loosen the arm so that that it's either completely "free" and rotating towards the edge of the bowl or mostly but not quite there. When I got my machine I had been told that even though it might appear that only the bowl was turning and the dough not mixing not to worry about it, just so long as my flour was fully incorporated of course. I thought that that sounded ridiculous but for whatever reason it seems to work anyway. I have granite counters (i.e. they're quite smooth and slippery) and routinely stand my machine about an inch or two from the edge of the counter and have never had it budge at all. --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v107.n029.4 --------------- From: MA Subject: Re: mister and more Date: Fri, 12 Oct 2007 08:17:04 -0700 Hi! Chris, I am a sort of new member as I have belonged to this off-and-on for numerous years. I am so glad the list continues even after the big move to California. 1) Olive oil misters. Good luck. I purchased one several years ago and when it worked, it worked great, but they tend to clog up and quit working after awhile. 2) Nothing beats a good old-fashioned wooden spoon for mixing. I do like some of the large silicone spoonulas for mixing, etc. I also like the Ultratemp spoons made by Pyrex or Robison Knife Company. If you can find them, they are now antiques almost LOL, they make the best kitchen spoons. Sturdy and they fit right in your hand. They can also be used with nonstick cookware and inside the microwave oven. Wonderful kitchen tools. I love my Pyrex glass batter bowl. It is the work horse of my kitchen as I can use it to measure out liquids, make batters and even cookie dough. I also like my silicone pastry brush. Be gone the old-fashioned pastry brush made with hairy fibers. The silicone brush is safe to use on almost everything and is so easy to keep clean. Mary --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v107.n029.5 --------------- From: "Barbara Ross" Subject: RE: Electrolux Assistent Date: Fri, 12 Oct 2007 11:34:52 -0400 >... it took me forever to mix the dough and I had to stand by the >machine the whole time to get the dough moving in the bowl. And who >said this one doesn't "walk" around the counter? I had the same problem for years and hated the machine, and then I found the secret and LOVE IT! The secret is to put all LIQUIDS in first, use the roller and scraper, then just enough flour to make a pancake like batter, and start mixing. Then gradually add all of your flour. It will mix perfectly AND you will get a better rise than you ever get from a KA (since I have a 6 qt KA too I can state this with experience). Good luck and let me know how it goes. Barbara Ross, Director SOS (Save Our Small) DOGS , a 501(c)3 non-profit org in NJ to rehome Yorkies, Bichons, Maltese, Westies & other toy/small breeds Website: www.sosdogs.org email: sosdogs@comcast.net --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v107.n029.6 --------------- From: debunix Subject: Re: Digest bread-bakers.v107.n028 Date: Fri, 12 Oct 2007 09:01:50 -0700 >GOOD olive oil mister/sprayer? I really hated my MISTO sprayer, because of its terrible clogging and uneven sprays. I decided to try one more time and bought the one linked below from King Arthur without high expectations--and this one *works*. I load a bit of my favorite olive oil in it and it sprays well from the first to the last drop of each batch, and I've only had to completely break it down to clean it once. Nice even sprays, not lots of uneven big droplets--for my pizzas and foccaccias etc. http://www.kingarthurflour.com/shop/detail.jsp?id=6184 --diane in los angeles http://www.well.com/user/debunix/recipes/FoodPages.html --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v107.n029.7 --------------- From: "Mary Fisher" Subject: Re: mister Date: Fri, 12 Oct 2007 19:44:20 +0100 "Chris Nelder" wrote: >Hi, I'm brand-new to this list. I found it in the Bread Baker's >Apprentice, and I'm looking for some advice on where to get a GOOD >olive oil mister/sprayer. I don't want to buy aerosol cans of oil. I haven't been able to find a reliable, long-lived and efficient one in UK :-( >As part of my "no more cheap Chinese kitchen utensils" campaign, I >want another alternative! Preferably, one that is all stainless >steel and/or glass, that will last 10 years or more. We're going to have to accept Chinese utensils whether we like it or not. Only by buying these items shall we improve the life of the Chinese people. I know it's a problem but ... We've bought a lot of Chinese goods and, to be frank, they're GOOD. >On a tip I found on one Web site, I did track down a plant mister >made of all stainless steel at Smith & Hawken, but it had a tag on >the bottom saying "NOT FOR FOOD USE" which I assume is because the >pieces were soldered together with regular lead solder. They had a >copper one too, but the salesperson said that was a no-no for food Well, there you go! >Now I think I must have to find an antique! Maybe an old perfume >atomizer, with a glass vial and a metal pump? And smelling of Eau de Wotnot? >This is driving me nuts! Any and all suggestions are appreciated! My observations above. Believe me, I'm not keen on supporting Chinese industry because of the human rights issue. I have my own hens to provide eggs which aren't produced using cruel intensive chicken growing. Do you? I'm not accusing you of cruelty but ... Mary --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v107.n029.8 --------------- From: Mike Avery Subject: Re: Olive Oil Sprayers Date: Sat, 13 Oct 2007 19:59:55 -0600 "Chris Nelder" asked: >...I'm looking for some advice on where to get a GOOD olive oil >mister/sprayer. I don't want to buy aerosol cans of oil. Been there, done that, got the t-shirt. I used the Mister Mister for some time. I had the problems you mention, along with a high price tag. I found a less expensive mister (whose name I forget) at a local health food store. It had a plastic body and the same sprayer mechanism as the 3x more expensive mister mister. Next, I found a similar unit from Pampered Chef. And, again, it had the same pump/sprayer mechanism that the mister mister had. Mister mister has a high price tag because the canister has been metalized - that is a chrome like metal has been applied to the cannister. All the units have the same issues. You can't fill them more than 1/3 full. If you do, the units will suck oil into the pump rather than drawing it up through the hose. Oil coming into the wrong part of the pump could damage the pump. I don't consider this a problem, really. I used my sprayers in a bakery and the capacity of the sprayers was not an issue. During busy times, I had to fill them twice a night. NOT an issue. However, olive oil (and other cooking oils) will plug the orifice and the sprayer will soon spray a stream instead of a mist. Cleaning the units is easy. Just finish off the oil (in home settings, don't fill it too full to start with), run clear water through it, then water with a drop or two of dish washing soap in it. The clogs clear out instantly. Then run clear water through the unit again and fill with oil. It takes less than a minute. However, the units were all clunky, and all got worse as time went on. Soon all they did was spray a stream instead of misting. I never found a sprayer/pump that worked for me. A number of professional bakers I know use Wagner airless sprayers to apply egg wash to pastries and such. It's not a good thing, im(ns)ho. It's a paint sprayer, it's not certified to spray food products. And, when I had one to paint some large areas, I thought it was a pretty wretched sprayer the hardware store clerk said the Wagner power roller was a great product, and that Wagner made them carry the sprayer, and that the return rate on the sprayer was in excess of 75%. In the end, I went to buying aerosol cans of olive oil. I have found cans with organic olive oil in them at our local grocery store. I miss the ability to use THE oil I want, but the cans work for me. Mike Mike Avery mavery at mail dot otherwhen dot com part time baker ICQ 16241692 networking guru AIM, yahoo and skype mavery81230 wordsmith Once seen on road signs all over the United States: When frisky With whiskey Don't drive 'Cause it's Risky Burma-Shave --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v107.n029.9 --------------- From: Mike Avery Subject: Re: Electrolux Assistent (Magic Mill) Date: Sat, 13 Oct 2007 20:17:30 -0600 yguaba@yahoo.com.br asked >I have used it a couple of times, the second one to mix a batch of >"high extraction flour miche" (from Peter Reinhart's Whole Grain >Breads). At first I was undecided as to whether I should use the >plastic roller attachment (which didn't look very strong) or the >metal dough hook. The manual (the Swedes may be good at building >powerful mixers, but they really need to work on their manual design >skills) says either one can be used to mix yeasted doughs. No argument about the manual. However, could you post the recipe so we have a better idea of what you are trying to mix? >I first tried the dough hook, but soon gave up because no matter how >high the speed, the dough stood in place while the bowl spun. A common problem. ALL mixers are based on friction, but it is more obvious when using the DLX. I like to use the hook for most breads. I fact, I've never used the roller at all. However, it works better for dough at lower speeds. I usually use the lowest speed. Depending on the size of the batch you are making, that is, especially with larger batches, putting all the liquids in the bowl, turning the mixer on, and then adding about half the flour right away, getting the flour and water to move, and then adding the rest of the flour a bit at a time helps. Tricks to get the flour moving - move the dough hook from the edge to the center of the bowl. Repeat this a few times. This disturbs the blobs that can develop in the bowl. Use a rubber spatula to get the wet flour off the hook and into motion. Once its moving, it will tend to stay moving. I use my DLX with its hook to mix very liquid starters (100% hydration) and everything down to 52% hydration bagel dough. I have mixed 18 4 oz bagels at a time in the DLX. I'm still getting my feel for the mixer, which I bought a few months ago. That size load would destroy most home mixers. The DLX never hesitated and it made excellent bagel dough - which is a real test for a mixer. >The scraper on the side didn't help the stuff move around, either. The scraper helps get flour off the side walls of the bowl and helps the mixer incorporate the flour faster - ONCE the flour is moving. I use a spatula as often as the scraper. You don't need full time scraping with most doughs. With doughs, rather than the batter like starters, the dough movement looks weird to people who are used to using a planetary mixer like a KitchenAid or Viking, or spiral mixers, or any other mixer for that matter. Clumps of dough move around the bowl while other clumps seem to be unmoved. However, the mixing and dough development is occurring, and is occurring well. The bagel dough I made with the DLX was probably the best developed bagel dough I have made in many, many years of baking. >For the Assistent, though, it seems to be too small; I imagine that >if the amount of dough were doubled it would probably start moving >around the bowl and actually mixing. I rarely make small batches, however a friend who has a Magic Mill (the older name for the Assistent or DLX) says he can mix as little as a few hundred grams of dough in his mixer. He uses the roller and scraper. I don't make small batches. I like to make at least 3 loaves at a time. I really can't comment on the roller, since I don't use it. >To make a long story short, it took me forever to mix the dough and >I had to stand by the machine the whole time to get the dough moving >in the bowl. And who said this one doesn't "walk" around the >counter? Mine was trotting and jumping hurdles! I had to actually >hold it down so it wouldn't just walk right off the edge of the counter. Mine sits on the counter nicely. No walking. No jumping. No strange behavior. Once the dough is in motion, I can ignore the machine completely. Since I haven't had the issues you mention, I really can't address them. However, I can make two suggestions that may or may not be related. Make sure the counter is clean and dry. I can imagine that the rubber feet could lose their grip if they, or the counter, had water or flour on them. Also, use the lowest speed, especially until the dough is moving. In general, the slower the dough development the better. Good luck, Mike Mike Avery mavery at mail dot otherwhen dot com part time baker ICQ 16241692 networking guru AIM, yahoo and skype mavery81230 wordsmith Once seen on road signs all over the United States: The cannoneers With hairy ears On wiry whiskers Used tin shears Until they found Burma-Shave --------------- END bread-bakers.v107.n029 --------------- Copyright (c) 1996-2007 Regina Dwork and Jeffrey Dwork All Rights Reserved