Date: Sun, 28 Apr 2002 00:41:35 -0600 (MDT) -------------- BEGIN bread-bakers.v102.n018 -------------- 001 - "Fredericka S Cohen" - hamburger buns 009 - Tarheel_Boy@webtv.net (Ta - Olive Garden Bread... 010 - "vicki & john" Subject: baking pans Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 08:26:34 -0400 I have purchased wonderful Chicago Metallic pans at Meijer and Target stores where they are discounted. KA is fine but they have full prices and shipping charges! Since I have been using Pam High Yield Food Release I haven't had a sticking problem. In fact, the crusts are wonderful! This is NOT the flavored every day stuff. Try it in warehouse stores.because it is the commercial kind. --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v102.n018.2 --------------- From: RKJohnson@aol.com Subject: Pepper bread Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 08:56:32 EDT While I intend to try several of those pepper breads recently posted, I've found that simply adding cracked pepper to my favorite white or wheat bread does an excellent job for sandwiches. I like it hot, about one TABLEspoon of coarse pepper per three cups of flour. I've got a grandson who likes it REALLY hot at two tablespoons in three cups, and make it for him frequently. Bob (not the Tarheel Baker, whose posts I love to read) --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v102.n018.3 --------------- From: "melissa milos" Subject: sour dough failure Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 09:02:58 -0400 I worked so hard to do as was instructed on this advice list and I know that no one wants to re visit the sourdough arguement, the sourdough was bubbly and beautiful the sponge (expantion) was bubbly and beautiful but the dough did not rise at all . whty, why, why, ok enough of the drama but the cost in time and dough hurts me truly. should I feed the dough some real yeast? any help would be wonderful. Melissa Milos milos.family@sympatico.ca --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v102.n018.4 --------------- From: Kathleen Ladesic Subject: Madeleine Pan Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 07:14:24 -0700 (PDT) Does anyone have any other recipes other than the traditional that can be made in a Madeleine pan? I've heard of using them for alternate batters but have been unsuccessful in my search. --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v102.n018.5 --------------- From: "Carolyn Schaffner" Subject: ceramic pans Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 10:27:56 est5edt I can't believe the number of helpful responses I received about the bun pans!! Thanks to each and every one of you. I also can't believe the website: http://www.tuftyceramics.com/Products.html My ceramic breadpans were produced by Alfred University, which I have heard is dropping the ceramics program... darn it! AND which is within 70 miles of me, here in Buffalo, NY. Carolyn Schaffner --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v102.n018.6 --------------- From: "Elizabeth" Subject: Bucks Co. olive bread Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 07:50:01 -0400 Hi all, I'd like to post a recipe for my favorite olive bread. I've made it a few times and it seems to be foolproof. It has always turned out, from the first time I made it, but sometimes takes longer than you expect to rise. It tastes very nice with goat cheese and dry red wine. My high school girlfriend Sue Rush (who grew up with me in Bucks Co., PA) sent it to me some years ago. BUCKS COUNTY OLIVE BREAD 2 packets dry yeast 2 1/2 c warm water (110-115 F) 6 1/2 to 7 c bread flour (can be 2 c bread + 5 c all-purpose flour) 1 c Italian olives, pitted and coarsely chopped (combination of green cracked Sicilian and kalamata) Combine the following and let soak in 2 T olive oil: 1/2 c chopped fresh sage 1 t dry oregano 1 t crushed red pepper flakes 1 to 1 1/2 T salt garlic powder or roasted fresh garlic cloves, to taste (I put in a good 5 or 6, hee hee) cornmeal ************************* Dissolve yeast in water. Let stand 5 min. Stir. Add 4 c flour. Beat 10 min. with flat beater. Add remaining 2 1/2 c flour and knead 5 min. with dough hook. Add olives and seasoning mixture. If necessary, add last 1/2 c flour and knead until dough pulls away from sides of bowl. Let dough rise on counter, covered with a large bowl, until double, about 2 hours (note: this sometimes takes longer). Punch down, cover with floured towel, and let rise again until double, about 1 1/2 hrs. (again, sometimes takes longer). Divide in half; deflate; shape into 2 rounds; place on cornmeal covered sheets and dust with flour. Using a sharp knife, slash design of your choice 1/4" into tops of loaves; dust lightly with flour and cover with floured towel. Let rise until double, about 45 min. Bake in preheated 450 F oven with pan of hot water on bottom shelf for 35 min. or until thermometer registers 190-200 F in center of loaf (I don't stick thermometers in loaves, myself, but...). This loaf can be baked as a simple free-standing round, in long French baking pans, and on a stone. For an extra-special crust, spray loaves with water 3 times during the first 7 minutes of baking (I usually forget to do this). This bread freezes well and stores VERY well. It's one of those that tastes better a day or two after you bake it; the flavors seem to meld while it sits. If there are any stale remains, they also make good croutons after you cut them in bits and bake them in the oven to crisp them. --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v102.n018.7 --------------- From: Susan Thomas Subject: hand or machine? - good question Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 09:59:57 -0700 I can't resist responding to someone's question about whether kneading by hand is better than making bread in a machine. . . . that discussion could probably go on forever! I've made LOTS of bread over the years, taught a yeast breads class for several years, and do not own a bread machine. However, instead of getting into an argumentative mode around that subject, there's a more important issue I wanted to speak to. Occasionally someone writes who is quite new to bread making. What I want to say to them is not to be intimidated by the long discussion of details around some subjects. These are fascinating to many who are long time bread makers, but I could see that they might overwhelm a person just beginning. One of the most wonderful things about making your own bread is that it's very forgiving: if you have to leave in the middle of the kneading, just stick it in the fridge and pick up where you left off later! Now that most folks use machines, that should be even truer, shouldn't it? (I hope so, anyway!) Anyway, have fun with it! It's great therapy, very creative, and the end result is SO much better than what you buy in a grocery. :o) Susan -- Susan & Jimj Thomas susanth@pacinfo.com --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v102.n018.8 --------------- From: Lobo Subject: hamburger buns Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 13:35:24 -0700 For all of you getting those hamburger bun pans .... These are excellent. The recipes halves beautifully if you don't want to make so many. I've elongated them and made hot dog buns too. HAMBURGER BUNS 12 cups flour 1 cup lard 3/4 cup sugar 1 tablespoon salt 2 beaten eggs 3 packages yeast 5 cups water Dissolve yeast in one cup water; then add other ingredients. A soft dough should result. Let rise 1 hour. Punch down. Let rise 1 hour. Shape into balls on greased cookie sheet. Let rise 1 hour. Bake at 375 F for 20 minutes. Makes 48 buns. These are suitable for freezing and are delicious when warmed. --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v102.n018.9 --------------- From: Tarheel_Boy@webtv.net (Tarheel Boy) Subject: Olive Garden Bread... Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 23:47:45 -0400 (EDT) This is for Lee McKean: This might be what you are looking for... Olive Garden Breadsticks 1 Loaf unfrozen bread dough - (if frozen, thaw in bowl at room temp) Pam or oil Garlic powder Dry oregano leaf -- rub between fingers When dough is soft enough to knead, spray your fingers with Pam or oil and knead just until you can shape into cigar-sized pieces (about 8 to 10). Place these 3" apart on Pam-sprayed cookie sheets. Let rise in warm place until doubled - about 1-1/2 hours. Then holding Pam about 8" from sticks, lightly spray top of each and then dust with garlic powder and oregano. Bake at 375 F about 20 to 25 minutes or until golden brown. Cool in pan on rack to serve within a day or two. Mangia! Bob the Tarheel Baker --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v102.n018.10 --------------- From: "vicki & john" Subject: Dead Bread Machine Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 21:08:05 -0700 I had a Regal bread machine for many years which I loved. Saturday I put the ingredients in for a simple plain white loaf of bread, and the machine wouldn't come on at all. Well, to make a long story short, it seems as though it is dead. So kneadless to say, no bread. there's no resurrecting it either. But after all, it served me well. But now, what to do? I'm thinking of just buying one of those Kitchen Aid mixers. If anybody's used those with great success in bread making, I'd love to hear about it. Thanks, Vicki --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v102.n018.11 --------------- From: Reggie Dwork Subject: King Arthur Demonstration Classes Date: Wed, 24 Apr 2002 15:34:52 -0700 The Baking Education Center King Arthur Flour, Norwich, Vermont 1.800.652.3334 DEMONSTRATION CLASSES May 7,2002 Micro-Bakeries--Food For The Community with Alan Scott Micro-Bakeries--Food For The Community with Alan Scott Join us for an evening with Alan Scott, masonry oven builder, baker and co-author of "The Bread Builders." Alan is at work on a new book about small bakeries and the opportunities they represent to provide a sustainable way of life for the baker, the community, and the planet. There will be plenty of time for your questions about breads, ovens, and baking. Meet Alan and his "Bread Builders" co-author, Dan Wing, in the comfortable surroundings of the Baking Education Center. May 7, 2002 Tuesday at 6 pm Cost:Free Registration Info: Please RSVP to Susan Miller at 802-649-3881, ext:344 or ext:372. ************** June 28, 2002 Hearth Loaves and Masonry Ovens Building Bread in a Wood-Burning Oven Dan Wing returns to King Arthur to discuss the advantages of baking in wood-fired ovens. The lecture will revolve around Dan's oven and the techniques he uses for steam and baking. June 28, 2002, Friday, 5-7 pm Cost:$40.00 Registration Info: Registration required. --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v102.n018.12 --------------- From: Reggie Dwork Subject: King Arthur Hands On Classes Date: Wed, 24 Apr 2002 15:58:21 -0700 The Baking Education Center King Arthur Flour, Norwich, Vermont 800-652-3334 HANDS ON CLASSES Beauty & The Baguette At last! Tame the beastly baguette with this hands-on class to help you make the best possible baguettes in your home oven. Learn how to work with a pre-ferment to achieve the maximum flavor. You will mix the dough in an electric mixer, then practice shaping and slashing loaves, and see how to set up your home oven to use steam for the crunchy crust we all crave! May 19, 2002, Sunday, 11-3 pm Cost:$65.00 Registration Info: Registration required. ************* Bread: Principles & Practice This comprehensive class explores every aspect of bread baking for the home baker. Lecture topics include the function of ingredients, pre-ferments, and how to facilitate maximum rise. There is extensive hands-on work in yeast breads, from basic bread through whole grains, sweetened breads, sourdough and starter-based breads. Some class time will also be devoted to techniques for baking powder breads, and the action of chemical leavens through the production of quick breads and scones. May 20-23, 2002, Mon through Thurs, 1-5 pm daily Cost:$350.00 Registration Info: Registration required. ************ Brioche for Brunch Discover the secrets to working with this wonderfully rich dough. Once you've mastered its production, the class will fashion a variety of brunch breads from the basic brioche dough, including some spectacular ideas for leftovers, if there are any! May 26, 2002, Sunday, 11-3 pm Cost:$65.00 Registration Info: Registration required. ************** Yeast Breads: The Basics & Beyond Overcome yeast anxiety forever with this class on basic yeast bread! Plunge your hands into the dough and see how easy it is to mix and knead bread that is successful every time. Learn how different ingredients affect the outcome of your loaves, and take home a loaf of the easiest bread you'll ever bake! May 28, 2002, Tuesday, 9am-noon Cost:$40.00 Registration Info: Registration required. ************** Far-Flung Flatbreads We've combed the world for the best flatbreads, and come up with an international assortment sure to whet your appetite for these ancient breads. From India to Italy, you'll taste your way across continents, mastering the simple techniques to reproduce each country's specialty in your own kitchen. May 30, 2002, Thursday, 6-8:30 pm Cost:$40.00 Registration Info: Registration required. ******************** A Sonata of Sweet Breads Wow your friends and family with these delicious and decorative sweet breads! Master the six-stranded braid, and discover the secrets of stollen and sticky buns to make the best possible presentation for meals and gifts alike. June 1, 2002, Saturday, 1-5 pm Cost:$65.00 Registration Info: Registration required. *********** The Magic of Wild Yeast: Sourdough Learn the traditional techniques for baking with sourdough, as well as some shortcuts for achieving sour flavor in your breads. This hands-on class teaches the care and feeding of sourdough starters, use of sourdough in yeasted and non-yeasted products, and techniques for achieving the crispiest possible crust. June 9, 2002, Sunday, 11-3 pm Cost:$65.00 Registration Info: Registration required. ************** Tea Time: Quick Breads & Scones Have light scones and tender tea breads eluded you? See how simple baking can be, with these quick and delicious recipes for tea(or any) time. Learn how to handle these delicate doughs for the tastiest results! June 13, 2002, Thursday, 6-8:30 pm Cost:$40.00 Registration Info: Registration required. *************** Yeast Breads: The Basics & Beyond Overcome yeast anxiety forever with this class on basic yeast bread! Plunge your hands into the dough and see how easy it is to mix and knead bread that is successful every time. Learn how different ingredients affect the outcome of your loaves, and take home a loaf of the easiest bread you'll ever bake! June 17, 2002, Monday, 6-9 pm Cost:$40.00 Registration Info: Registration required. ****************** Pizza Perfected We love pizza, and we've come up with some techniques that will make pizza to rival any you can buy. The class will cover the best dough and how to transform it into the crust you crave! We'll also discuss true, Neopolitan-style pizza and which cheeses and toppings offer the most authenticity! June 20, 2002, Thursday, 6-8:30 pm, Cost:$40.00 Registration Info: Registration required. *********************** Lofty Layers: Laminated Doughs Learn the secrets of handling these tricky doughs. You'll practice folds to create tender, crisp croissants. The class will focus on production, but we'll also share tips for keeping this precious commodity on hand for impromtu festivities. June 22, 2002, Saturday, 1-5 pm Cost:$65.00 Registration Info: Registration required. ********************* Hearth Loaves and Masonry Ovens With Dan Wing, author of The Bread Builders: Hearth Loaves & Masonry Ovens. Join us for a weekend of Hearth breadbaking with Dan Wing, author of The Bread Builders: Hearth Loaves & Masonry Ovens. Attendance in the demonstration is a pre-requisite for participation in the hands-on class. The price reflects the cost of both classes. June 28-29, 2002, Friday, 5-7 pm & Saturday, 9-1 pm Cost:$150.00 Registration Info: Registration required. ************** Hearth Loaves and Masonry Ovens Sourdough Hearth Bread: Theory & Technique The class will learn how to expand leavens, divide dough and shape loaves. Students will also slash and bake loaves outdoors in Dan's masonry oven. June 29, 2002, Saturday, 9-1 pm Cost:$125.00 Registration Info: Registration required. ************** Yeast Breads: The Basics & Beyond Overcome yeast anxiety forever with this class on basic yeast bread! Plunge your hands into the dough and see how easy it is to mix and knead bread that is successful every time. Learn how different ingredients affect the outcome of your loaves, and take home a loaf of the easiest bread you'll ever bake! Tuesday, 9 am to noon Cost:$40.00 Registration Info: Registration required. ****************** Beauty & The Baguette At last! Tame the beastly baguette with this hands-on class to help you make the best possible baguettes in your home oven. Learn how to work with a pre-ferment to achieve the maximum flavor. You will mix the dough in an electric mixer, then practice shaping and slashing loaves, and see how to set up your home oven to use steam for the crunchy crust we all crave! Sunday, 11 to 3 pm Cost:$65.00 Registration Info: Registration required. ********** Breads From A Country Kitchen with Michael Jubinsky Michael Jubinsky, a longtime spokesperson for King Arthur Flour, has been spreading the good King Arthur word through national bread baking demonstrations for 17 years. Join Mr. Jubinsky and banish yeast anxiety forever with this intensive workshop on old-fashioned breads. Learn the secret to tender rolls and sticky buns, and discover how to make the best breads for toasting, slicing and sandwiches. Among the recipes are Violet's Oatmeal Bread, Sweet Orange Rye Bread, and Cinnamon and Pecan Sticky Buns. Class size limited to 12. Friday, 2-6 pm & Saturday 9-3 pm Cost:$195.00 Registration Info: Registration required. *************** Breads of the Mediterranean Explore the summery of the Mediterranean, including Carta Da Musica, a bread that is as thin as sheets of music paper. Sunday, 11 to 3 pm Cost:$65.00 Registration Info: Registration required. ************ Treasures Of The Deep (3rd, 4th & 5th grade completed) Merlin's Magic Oven-Baking Camp for Kids Create a sand castle good enough to eat at Merlin's Magic Baking Camp for Kids. Dive in to baking oysters & pearls and a life preserver bread decorated with denizens of the deep! July 29-August 1, Mon-Thurs, 1-4 pm daily Cost:$150.00 Registration Info: Registration required. **************** The Magic of Wild Yeast: Sourdough Learn the traditional techniques for baking with sourdough, as well as some shortcuts for achieving sour flavor in your breads. This hands-on class teaches the care and feeding of sourdough starters, use of sourdough in yeasted and non-yeasted products, and techniques for achieving the crispiest possible crust. Sunday, 11 to 3 pm Cost:$65.00 Registration Info: Registration required. ***************** Bread: Principles & Practice This comprehensive class explores every aspect of bread baking for the home baker. Lecture topics include the function of ingredients, pre-ferments, and how to facilitate maximum rise. There is extensive hands-on work in yeast breads, from basic bread through whole grains, sweetened breads, sourdough and starter-based breads. Some class time will also be devoted to techniques for baking powder breads, and the action of chemical leavens through the production of quick breads and scones. Monday through Thursday 1 to 5 pm daily Cost:$350.00 Registration Info: Registration required. ************* Starter to Finish: Starter-Based Artisan Loaves with Judy Ulinski What gives artisan bread that wonderful, chewy texture and deep, rich flavor? It's the starter, a combination of flour, water and a pinch of yeast tempered for an hour, a day, a week/or a lifetime. We will examine the classic American sponge, the Italian biga, and the French polish and levain, and bake breads ranging from a crusty country loaf to a savory nut-and-cheese-filled fougasse, incredibly brick-oven style pizza, and more. Class size limited to 12. Friday, 2 to 6 pm & Saturday, 9 to 3 pm Cost:$195.00 Registration Info: Registration required. ***************** Life's A Picnic: Baking To Go Whether you're on the beach, at the lake or enjoying the backyard patio, Torta Rustica and Pissaladiere are "a meal in a bread" and best enjoyed outdoors at room temperature. Sunday, 11 to 3 pm Cost:$65.00 Registration Info: Registration required. **************** Bread-Based Summer Salads For those hot, summer nights when you crave the bright flavors of the vegetable garden, learn to make panzanella and fattoush: two international salads that combine vegetables and bread with delicious results! Monday, 6 to 8:30 pm Cost:$40.00 Registration Info: Registration required. ************** Yeast Breads: The Basics & Beyond Overcome yeast anxiety forever with this class on basic yeast bread! Plunge your hands into the dough and see how easy it is to mix and knead bread that is successful every time. Learn how different ingredients affect the outcome of your loaves, and take home a loaf of the easiest bread you'll ever bake! Thursday, 6 to 9 pm Cost:$40.00 Registration Info: Registration required. ************* Breads of the Mediterranean Explore the summery of the Mediterranean, including Carta Da Musica, a bread that is as thin as sheets of music paper. Saturday, 1 to 5 pm Cost:$65.00 Registration Info: Registration required. --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v102.n018.13 --------------- From: Reggie Dwork Subject: King Arthur Professional Level Courses Date: Wed, 24 Apr 2002 16:04:13 -0700 The Baking Education Center King Arthur Flour, Norwich, Vermont 800-652-3334 Professional Level Courses with Jeffrey Hamelman $750.00 June 3 - 7, 2002 Fundamentals of Bread Baking BEC601 060302 July 8 - 12, 2002 Advanced Bread Baking BEC602 070802 Aug 5 - 9, 2002 Fundamentals of Bread Baking BEC601 080502 Sept 23 - 27, 2002 Introduction to International Pastries BEC603 092302 Oct 28 - Nov 1, 2002 Fundamentals of Bread Baking BEC601 102802 Nov 4 - 8, 2002 Advanced Bread Baking BEC602 110402 Jan 20 - 24, 2003 Introduction to International Pasteries BEC603 012003 --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v102.n018.14 --------------- From: "Helen & Peter Frati" Subject: Traditional Rugelach Date: Thu, 25 Apr 2002 08:29:16 -0400 Traditional Rugelach Dough: 3 cups all-purpose flour 1/2 teaspoon salt 1/4 cup Sugar 1 1/4 cups unsalted Butter, cut into 1-inch chunks 3 Egg yolks 1 cup Sour Cream or Plain Yogurt Fillings: Apricot or Raspberry Jam Brown or Granulated Sugar Ground Cinnamon Chopped Nuts Miniature Chocolate Chips Shredded Coconut Dried Cherries, Raisins, or Cranberries Garnish Egg White or Whole Egg, beaten Granulated or coarse Sugar (optional) Place flour, salt, sugar in the food processor. Place the butter chunks on top and pulse until the mixture is crumbly, add egg yolks and sour cream. Pulse a few times, then process until the mixture sticks together and forms a mass. Smooth or pat the dough on a lightly floured work surface. Divide it into 2 to 3 portions (2 portions for larger pastries; 3 portions for smaller ones). Wrap each portion well and chill the dough for an hour. You can also freeze it until needed. Preheat the oven to 350 F. Line a large, doubled-up baking sheet with parchment paper. Rugelach can be very sticky and parchment paper is essential. Roll 1 portion of dough into a 12-inch circle. Spread the jam, sprinkle with white or brown sugar and cinnamon or with ground nuts, miniature chocolate chips, raisins, or whatever filling you choose. Cut the dough into 12 to 14 portions or wedges. Roll up each portion, starting from a point, to form small crescents. Place the Rugelach on the baking sheet. Brush with the beaten egg and sprinkle with sugar, if using. Repeat this process with the remaining dough and your preferred fillings. Bake until lightly golden (25 to 35 minutes, depending on the size of the Rugelach). Cool on baking sheet for 10 minutes, then remove to a wire rack to complete cooling. From _A Treasury Of Jewish Holiday Baking_ by Marcy Goldman There is also Kipfels, Hungarian Sweet Crescents, which are made with a yeast dough. Hope this helps, Helen Frati --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v102.n018.15 --------------- From: "Helen & Peter Frati" Subject: Black Pepper Bread Date: Sat, 27 Apr 2002 08:13:27 -0400 I received two recipes for Black Pepper Bread, this one is from Jazzbel. She got it from Food Network. Black Pepper Bread 2 cups plus 2 tablespoons milk 3 tablespoons unsalted butter 2 tablespoons sugar 1 1/2 teaspoons butcher's grind cracked black pepper One 1/4 ounce package active dry yeast 5 cups all-purpose flour 1 tablespoon fine salt vegetable oil, as needed In a small saucepan, combine the milk, butter, sugar, and pepper. Place over medium-high heat and bring to about 110 F. Remove from the heat and sprinkle the yeast over the surface of the milk. Set aside until foamy, about 10 minutes. Meanwhile, in a large bowl, whisk together the flour and salt. Pour the milk and yeast mixture into the bowl of flour and mix until a soft, ragged mixture is formed. Transfer the mixture to a well-floured work surface and knead until a soft elastic dough is formed, about 10 minutes. Transfer the dough to a lightly oiled bowl, cover with a kitchen towel, and place in a warm spot, until puffed and doubled in size, about 2 hours. Place a rack in the center of the oven and preheat to 400 F. Transfer the dough to the work surface and, using your hands, gently flatten it into a 10-inch-long oval shape. Fold the dough into thirds lengthwise overlapping the sides in the center. Press down on the overlapping sides to seal and make a seam. Place it seam side-down in a buttered 9 by 5-inch loaf pan, cover with a kitchen towel, and return to the warmest part of the kitchen until the dough has risen about 1 1/2 inches over the top of the pan, about 1 1/2 to 2 hours. Brush the top of the dough lightly with warm water and, using a sharp knife, make 1/4-inch-deep slit down the center. Bake until golden brown, about 30 minutes. Remove the loaf from the pan and place in the center of the rack. Continue baking until the loaf sounds hollow when rapt lightly with your knuckles on the bottom and top, and a thermometer inserted in the center reads 200 F., about 15 minutes. Transfer the bread loaf to a cooling rack and let cool for 2 hours before using. I think heating the black pepper with the milk and butter infuses the flavor of the pepper, I think next time I will use more black pepper. :) Thanks again, Jazzbel. Helen Frati Have another recipe that Sandy Greathouse sent and after I make it will send it. I really enjoy all the information, debates, and stories. --------------- END bread-bakers.v102.n018 --------------- Copyright (c) 1996-2002 Regina Dwork and Jeffrey Dwork All Rights Reserved