Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 03:03:07 -0800 (PST) -------------- BEGIN bread-bakers.v100.n073 -------------- 001 - "David C. Taylor" Subject: Recipe Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 15:31:48 -0500 Does anyone have a recipe for Potato Onion Rye bread they would be willing to share? I used to buy this at a bakery in Ithaca, NY but have never found a recipe to make it at home. Thanks. Dave --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n073.2 --------------- From: Raymond Kenyon Subject: Rye Breads Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2000 08:28:38 -0600 The best commercial rye breads come from "Dimpflmeir". They are flavorful, heavy, and moist. I suspect their names (such as "Jagdschnitten") are just made up. I can't find them in any books. If anyone has recipes for their breads, please share them with me. --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n073.3 --------------- From: Reggie Dwork Subject: DAK phone number and address Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 21:00:25 -0800 Someone wrote to me yesterday and gave me DAK's new info..... here it is for all of you... DAK Gourmet Products 1711 Irvine Ave. Newport Beach, CA 92660 1-800-600-3500 1-949-646-3000 or FAX: 1-800-363-3599 1-949-646-1700 http://www.dakgourmet.com --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n073.4 --------------- From: "Lorna Noble" Subject: Bread-machine recipe conversions Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 10:46:18 +0000 Me again, Is there any way of converting the instructions for a bread-machine recipe to a conventional one. Not having access to such a gadget, it's a bit frustrating seeing all these lovely recipes on the group. Ta. -- Lorna Noble Strathbungo Glasgow Scotland --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n073.5 --------------- From: "Pat Stewart" Subject: Lop-Sided Horizontal Loaf Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2000 10:05:08 -0500 I used a Zo upright for years (model discontinued but still going strong). I acquired a horizontal loaf Zo a couple of years ago as my second machine. Problem: if I don't watch the horizontal loaf and "rearrange" the dough, I wind up with a lop-sided loaf. It seems stupid to have a programmable bread machine that I have to watch... Any suggestions? --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n073.6 --------------- From: Bob Snelgrove Subject: Ultimate Dispener Prob Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2000 07:09:14 -0800 Reggie, Have you actually tried ingredients in the dispenser? It sounds like it is opening but needs the weight of the ingredients to help it open fully? [[Reggie says "yes".]] When it opens, can you move or swing it freely without binding? [[ Reggie says "No, it binds. The question is what to oil it with that won't burn or poison the bread." ]] bob --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n073.7 --------------- From: Reggie Dwork Subject: Carl Griffith's starter Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 21:54:32 -0800 Here is new info on how to get some of Carl's starter ... Carl Griffith's grandmother brought sourdough starter with her on the Oregon Trail. For many years, Carl sent out dried portions of this starter to anyone who asked. Carl passed away at the age of 80 early in 2000. Friends of Carl continue this tradition. To get Carl's starter go to: http://home.att.net/~carlsfriends/ --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n073.8 --------------- From: "Rusty Burlew" Subject: Ultra Fine Grind vs Regular Grind Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2000 11:00:24 -0800 I am an agronomist, also familiar with particle sizes in soil. I was amazed to learn how many geophysicists and hydrologists bake bread, and were willing to respond to this particular subject. Is there something about playing with flour and water that is very similar to playing with dirt and water? It's fascinating! Rusty Burlew rustyburlew@worldnet.att.net --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n073.9 --------------- From: Nifcon@aol.com Subject: Oven temperature for parchment Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2000 10:14:28 EST For Mary (Scullery Maid) I regularly bake loaves on baking parchment up to 230 centigrade in my fan oven and have no trouble BUT the paper around the edge of the loaf does brown and become brittle in 15 minutes cooking so it may be that 230 C is approaching the limit of the material. Magic Carpet is guaranteed up to 250 C and the sheet I'm currently baking with has been used > 150 times and is as good as new. John Wright Yorkshire, England --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n073.10 --------------- From: Gene Haldas Subject: Breadman Ultimate Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 20:51:38 -0800 I've been baking my bread for many years by hand. A couple months ago I purchased a Breadman Ultimate. The bread comes out very satisfactory and sure takes the work out of baking bread. I do have a question. The crust comes out rather light even with the dark crust setting. Is there a way to get the crust darker? Today I added 7 minutes to the baking time and it still wasn't dark enough. The bread otherwise is very good. Any suggestions? --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n073.11 --------------- From: "Lorna Noble" Subject: Re: Jewish Rye Bread and Bagels Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 10:44:55 +0000 > 002 - "Joni Repasch" Bagels >2 1/4 teaspoons active dry yeast (not rapid-rise) or 0.6-ounce package > (about 2 1/2 teaspoons) fresh yeast Just a quickie, I loved the story, and the recipes look great. However, I use yeast which doesn't require proving when making bread (getting fresh is impossible, and dried is less reliable), and wondered why you insist on dry/fresh instead of instant-bake? Thanks -- Lorna Noble Strathbungo Glasgow Scotland --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n073.12 --------------- From: NSimZim@aol.com Subject: Oster Bread Machine Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2000 17:16:24 EST Dave Atkinson recently posted a dilemma he had with his Oster bread machine pan. Last year I had a different problem with my Oster pan, the finish on the inner part of the pan was peeling. As it was still within warranty (and just under two years old), I called Oster and got the same run around that Dave got. By the end of my search and pleading, not only did they send me a pan, they sent me four; they couldn't figure out which pan would fit my model (although I gave them the model number). One of these pans was the right pan, but the extension collar broke the next week. I am still using my machine for smaller loaves, but dread the time when it might again need service. Understanding your frustration, Nancy Zimbalist --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n073.13 --------------- From: Reggie Dwork Subject: Basic Baking by Lora Brody Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2000 23:37:48 -0800 I just saw a copy of Basic Baking by Lora Brody. Let me share my thoughts with you on this new book ... I think it would be the perfect gift for a newly wed, newly moved out young adult, or anyone who needs some clearly explained instructions for basic baking. She has included 100+ recipes that are explained so clearly that someone who has little experience baking will be able to follow them with excellent product results. I found extremely interesting the first section that describes equipment, basic terms and instructions for producing toasted coconut (for example). Congratulations to Lora on another wonderful cookbook. There are no yeasted bread recipes but there are some quick bread recipes along with scones and muffins. Cakes and other goodies glore!! Reggie --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n073.14 --------------- From: EHarbison@aol.com Subject: Apple Bread Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2000 10:11:10 EST Here's an apple bread. Caveat: It's a variation on an Apple Walnut bread from my May 2001 book, but I haven't tested it this way yet. -Beth Harbison www.ElizabethHarbison.com APPLE BREAD 3/4 c apple juice 1 T butter or margarine 1 3/4 c bread flour 1 c old-fashioned rolled oats 2 T oat bran 1 t salt 1 1/2 t cinnamon 2 T brown sugar 2 t granulated sugar 1 medium apple, cored, peeled and chopped (about 1/2 c) 3 scant t yeast Add the ingredients to your bread machine, except the raisins and walnuts (and apple pieces, if you choose), according to the manufacturer's instructions. Add the raisins and walnuts at the indicator beep or up to 5 minutes before the end of the final knead. Alternatively, you may choose to add everything at the beginning and let it be kneaded smoothly into the bread. Bake on a sweet, regular/white, light, or rapid cycle --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n073.15 --------------- From: "Werner Gansz" Subject: NYC Hard Rolls Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 09:36:22 -0500 Does anyone have a recipe for real New York Hard Rolls (Kaiser Rolls?)? I have tried several and the closest textbook recipe to what I remember growing up in and around NY is the German "Kaisersemmel" recipe in Joe Ortiz's "The Village Baker". In the first line of his description of the rolls he says that they are "light in texture with a crisp crust" which is what I remember. Although I think Ortiz's book is one of the best teaching books on bread baking around and have had success with most of his breads, this one has eluded me. I have given this one about a 5 tries and the rolls always come out very dense and almost bagel-like in internal texture. The mechanics of using a weight on the rolls during the final rise also causes the folded petal pattern on the top surface to disappear and probably causes the texture to be denser. I would like try another recipe or procedure. The rolls I remember were light brown to gold in color, light in texture but not necessarily "holey", and had crumbly crust that pulled apart easily petal by petal. Werner --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n073.16 --------------- From: "Scullery Maid" Subject: Questions about kitchen scales Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 10:29:17 CST I'm thinking of getting a new kitchen scale. Right now I have an old scale that I use mainly for pasta and potatoes, but I'd like to try baking by weight, and I'll need something more accurate. What are the advantages and disadvantages of measuring dry and wet ingredients by weight? Is it really faster and more accurate? Will I still have to measure small amounts of salt and yeast by hand? Are digital scales really more accurate, or does the read-out just make them appear so? It sounds as though a tare feature would be a real help. How accurate should the scale be? Some are accurate to .1 oz., and some to .05 oz. Is that kind of accuracy necessary? I won't be weighing huge amounts -- usually make only one loaf of bread at a time. Also, I want to be able to use my own bowls, and I'd prefer that it not take up too much counter space. I also need both English and metric measurements, since my son sends me recipes in metric from overseas. My research so far has led me to the Salter aquatronic (KA catalog) and the Swiss-built Soehnle, which is supposed to be very accurate. I know this an awful lot of questions, but I'd really appreciate any help and opinions. Thanks! Mary B. --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n073.17 --------------- From: TheGuamTarheels@webtv.net (The Ol' Tarheel) Subject: French Cornmeal Bread Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 13:41:10 -0500 (EST) Joni Repasch wanted to know how I fared with hand kneading this recipe that Reggie posted in bread machine format. Here's how and what I did: French Cornmeal Bread 3 1/2 cups bread flour 1/2 cup cornmeal 1 1/2 teaspoons salt 2 tablespoons sugar 1 1/2 teaspoons instant yeast 2 tablespoons olive oil 1 1/3 cups water Mix all dry ingredients thoroughly and then stir in olive oil and water. Turn out on a lightly floured surface and knead until the dough passes the "stick-your-finger-in-it" test. Place in an oiled bowl, cover, and let rise for 1-1/2 to 2 hours. Punch down and let rise for another hour. Preheat oven to 450F with a baking stone. Punch down and shape into a boule. Let rise for 30 minutes while oven is cranking up. Slash and spray top of dough (I sprinkled some ground thyme on top). With a peel, slide onto stone, spray oven with water, and turn heat down to 400F. Bake for 35 to 40 minutes or until the bread's interior temperature is 190F and crust is golden brown. Cool on rack for at least 45 minutes before slicing. Note: I find that this bread has somewhat of a cake-like consistency. I didn't care for it too much as a dinner bread (dipped in olive oil), but it was great this morning when I toasted it. Bob the Tarheel Baker --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n073.18 --------------- From: "Jane Koca" Subject: bread baking with kids Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 07:59:36 EST Help! I volunteer at a "Kids Cafe" a program of the Second Harvest Foodbank. At Kids Cafe, underprivileged children from a local school district are fed a nutritious evening meal, and given a safe nurturing place to spend after school time; some of the children have expressed an interest in learning to make bread; -so I am the one privileged to teach them------has anyone ever done this? any helps and ideas? The Fleischman's yeast site has been helpful, but I am interested in hearing from anyone who has really done this. I will have four or five 12-13 year old girls to start. We are starting with a bread mix, courtesy of the local food bank, and so this first time will just learn about the liquid temperature, kneading, etc. Next time, we will start from scratch. I am excited about this project---you know the old saying "Give a person a fish and you feed them for a day; teach them how to fish, and you feed them for a lifetime", but would welcome and suggestions or ideas. Thanks for any help you can give me! Bread bakers are the best! Jane dough PS: The good Benedictine Sisters get the credit for this program in Erie, PA (Northwestern PA Food Bank); it is an outreach ministry of their Emmaus Ministries including their soup kitchen. I am just a volunteer and the bread baking teacher. --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n073.19 --------------- From: "Regina Rectanus" Subject: Re: List Auth Request ID ACCEPT Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 14:55:21 -0500 Thank you Peggy (v100.064.10) for the Tupperware website! I've had no luck keeping my home made bread fresh either in the frig or on the counter. I ordered the Tupperware bread keeper on line and I am just delighted with the results! I live in Florida where it becomes humid even with air conditioning on all the time and I've had no problem with moldy bread. I sometimes park it in the frig if I think we might be busy and not get it eaten. It's a bit pricey but worth it for keeping the bread fresh even after a week! I found an adequate substitute in a large Rubbermaid square canister which I purchased some time ago at Lechter's, a housewares store found it most malls. It is squarish and tall. The bottom is stamped #7 and the words 21 cups. I have used it for everything from storing my specialty flours in the refrigerator to cookies and raising dough when I have a large two loaf recipe. It tucks away, up above the cupboard over the refrigerator which is a cozy place for getting dough to raise. I tried it with my 2 lb. loaf and it fits nicely. My Breadman makes square type loaves and this accommodates the larger 2 lb. size quite well. It has a snap on lid which fits securely. By the way, the recipe on the bag of the King Arthur Flour for Bread Machines entitled "Toast and Sandwich Bread", produces a consistently wonderful loaf of white bread which toasts beautifully but is still moist in the middle and just delicious. bread-bakers lists is just the greatest! Regina --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n073.20 --------------- From: "Ellen C." Subject: BASIC FORMULA FOR A ONE-POUND LOAF Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 14:07:46 -0500 The Vegetarian Resource Group had this "formula" at their website. I thought it might be useful for those wanting to design their own breads. I have a question, though, since this uses 3 cups of flour, wouldn't this actually make a 1 1/2 lb loaf? Ellen * Exported from MasterCook Mac * BASIC FORMULA FOR A ONE-POUND LOAF Recipe By : Brad Scot www.vrg.org Serving Size : 12 Preparation Time :0:00 Categories : Breads Amount Measure Ingredient -- Preparation Method -------- ------------ -------------------------------- 1 cup liquid -- * 1 Tablespoon sweetener 1/2 teaspoon salt 3 cups flour -- ** 1 1/2 teaspoons active dry yeast (Serves 12) This simple recipe can easily be modified to suit your taste. * (water, soy milk, or apple juice for example) ** (a combination of any two or more white, oat, rye, or whole wheat bread flour) Total Calories Per Serving: 107 Fat: less than 1 gram Most machines have you place the liquids in the breadpan first, then add the dry ingredients on top, ending with the yeast, but since some have you do it in the opposite order, check the manufacturer's instructions. If you are so inclined, freshly ground flour can make a big difference in the flavor. The following are some of my personal favorite recipes. Follow the instructions for your breadmaker. I eat the bread as is, fresh from the breadmaker. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Per serving (excluding unknown items): 117 Calories; less than one gram Fat (3% calories from fat); 3g Protein; 24g Carbohydrate; 0mg Cholesterol; 92mg Sodium Food Exchanges: 1 1/2 Starch/Bread --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n073.21 --------------- From: TaktEZ@aol.com Subject: KA Mixer Problem Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2000 18:11:34 EST Folks, I need your help. A little over two years ago I purchased a KitchenAid 4 1/2 quart mixer for the purpose of dough kneading. I use it about once a week. This past Tuesday it died and went to mixer heaven. It appears to have stripped it's gears trying to knead a six cup of flour recipe for two loaves of plain white bread. The local factory service center said it would cost $100 dollars to repair it. I now own a very expensive door stop. I phoned the customer service people at KA and was told that this unit is only capable of kneading no more than six cups of flour, at a speed not to exceed two and for a total kneading duration of not more than four minutes. Geez, that just takes it right out of the category of being a serious dough kneading machine. When I asked about their more substantial units, the limitations were only slightly more generous. It appears that since Whirlpool purchased the manufacturing rights to the KA mixer line from Hobart they have successfully taken the workhorse of the mixer world and reduced it to circus pony status. I refuse to buy another KA. Anyhow, on to my present dilemma. I want to buy a heavy duty dough kneading machine. At this time cost is not an issue. I figure buying a heavy duty unit will be more cost effective in the long run than spending a hundred bucks every time the KA croaks. I'm presently considering the Kenwood KM800, the Magic Mill DLX-2000, and the Bosch. I would like to hear from anyone who has had experience with these or any other machines that they would recommend for dough kneading. I normally prepare two loaves at a time. On rare occasions only one loaf so the machine would have to be able to handle moderate as well as heavy loads. Thanks in advance, any help will be greatly appreciated. Don B My e-mail address is: TaktEZ@aol.com --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n073.22 --------------- From: "Carolyn Hollenbeck" Subject: Carlo's pizza dough Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 15:13:19 -0500 This is for Digger. The basic recipe is from Carlo. I have included my own tricks, too. Carolyn Pizza Dough THE FOOD OF SOUTHERN ITALY By Carlo Medione 2/3 C. warm water 1 1/2 tsp. yeast, dry or fresh 3/4 tsp. salt 2 cups bread flour (I use King Arthur) 3 Tbs. Extra virgin olive oil Sprinkle dry yeast over the surface of the warm water, or crumble the fresh yeast into the water. Let it sit for 3 or 4 minutes and then gently whisk the water around to mix the yeast. Add the olive oil. Add the flour, mix with the liquid and start kneading. (Carlo's recipe adds the salt to the yeast before adding the flour.I always add the salt after part of the flour is incorporated, as I have read that adding the salt too soon can affect the gluten.) If using an electric mixer, knead on medium speed for about 7 minutes. Knead by hand for about 15 minutes. Even if the dough is very sticky, do not add flour until you are convinced that further kneading and contact with air will not dry it out. When the dough is well kneaded, put the dough into a clean bowl and cover it with a clean kitchen towel. (I use a large plastic dough bucket with a lid.any container will work, but it should be covered. Plastic wrap is fine.) Proof for about 2 hours in a warm place (about 80 F). The dough should be at least twice the original volume. Deflate it, put the cover back on, and let rise again for another 2 to 3 hours. The longer and slower the proofing, the better the bread will taste. (You can also mix the dough and rise in the refrigerator overnight.) The dough is now ready to make pizza. When I am making multiple pizzas, I store the portions in a ziploc bag that contains a small amount of olive oil. Many times, I will make the dough in the AM and keep the dough portions in these bags until I am ready to use them for dinner. I use a pizza stone that has been preheated at least 30 minutes and bake the pizzas at 500 F. (Occasionally I use a gas grill.) Note: When I make pizzas I usually triple this recipe. You then have several options. You can prepare the dough and let it rise in the refrigerator overnight. I usually get 6 smaller pizzas form a triple batch. Many times, I let the dough rise twice and then divide into 6 portions which I then wrap loosely in plastic wrap, place in a Ziploc freezer bag and place in the freezer. You can defrost overnight in the refrigerator for use the next day, or you can defrost for a few hours at room temp. It is a quick way to have dough ready at short notice You can use this recipe, omitting the olive oil to make Italian style bread. After the second rising, shape the dough into a round loaf. You can use a floured piece of parchment to raise the dough on. Let rise, covered with a floured kitchen towel until plump. This will take about an hour, depending on the temperature of your kitchen. Use a preheated 475 F oven. Slash the top with a razor. Place onto the stone. For a loaf with a thick crust, put a shallow pan of hot water in the oven at the same time bread. Leave it there for the entire baking time. After 10 minutes at 475 F, reduce temp to 400 F and continue baking for about 40 min. To test for doneness, knock it on the bottom. It should sound hollow and be golden in color. --------------- END bread-bakers.v100.n073 --------------- Copyright (c) 1996-2000 Regina Dwork and Jeffrey Dwork All Rights Reserved