Date: Sat, 29 Jul 2000 00:11:17 -0700 (PDT) -------------- BEGIN bread-bakers.v100.n053 -------------- 001 - "Nancy M. Schnepp" Subject: thanks for pan info Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 15:05:04 -0500 (EST) Thanks so much to so many bread bakers who responded to my request for an abelskiver pan! I will let you know how things work out. If I did not thank you all personally, sorry!! Happy baking! Take care, -Nancy S. --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n053.2 --------------- From: BillyFish@aol.com Subject: Sticky rye dough Date: Sat, 22 Jul 2000 19:01:37 EDT I like using rye flour for the taste. The trouble is that even a small amount of rye flour in the recipe causes an incredibly stick dough to form. It sticks to my hands and just about anything else. I use a bread machine for kneading. Is this normal? Is there anything that can be done about it? Bill --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n053.3 --------------- From: "Deb Strong-Napple" Subject: "heavy" bread Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 17:38:21 PDT To Barbara Moore: I find that adding "Vital Wheat Gluten" to my bread really helps to lighten the bread. It can be bought at most health food stores and good groceries, and recommended quantities for use are on the package. ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n053.4 --------------- From: Reggie Dwork Subject: Summer Loaf - Kids classes Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 21:38:49 -0700 There is still plenty of space in the two kid's bread baking classes on Saturday ("Rolling in Dough") at Summer Loaf in Portland, OR. Both classes are for 7-11 year olds, with the second one for those who either took last year's class or who have a little knowledge of cooking or baking already. The classes are being taught by returning visitor David Deutsch, a third grade teacher and bread baker. Cost is $20. --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n053.5 --------------- From: "Richard L Walker" Subject: Irish brown bread Date: Sat, 22 Jul 2000 19:32:13 -0500 I am looking for an Irish Brown Bread recipe that has multiple grains, a LOT of texture (if not crunch), a very brown color and is possibly made with yeast rather than baking soda. My wife had quite a lot of this type bread on the west coast of Ireland and found it was not available in Dublin before she returned home. Does anyone have such a recipe? "Richard L Walker" Pensacola, FL 32504-7726 USA --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n053.6 --------------- From: Lynn Cragholm Subject: Finnish rye bread Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 09:09:51 -0800 A friend asked me the other day if I had a recipe for a Finnish rye bread that his mother, who was from Finland, used to make before she died when he was yet a child. To his little boy ears, it sounded to him as though she called the bread REYGALEVA, or something like that. He remembers eating this bread with much gusto and very much would like to have a recipe for it if anyone out there can help in this regard. Thank you for assisting in this search which would make someone very happy to make a once much-liked bread in memory of his beloved mother. Lynn Cragholm --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n053.7 --------------- From: Marilyn Warren Subject: Rye Bread From The CIA Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 10:59:08 -0700 I am looking for a recipe for Rye Bread as broadcast on the PBS series on the CIA (Culinary Institute of America not the spy place). It took three days to make, used all rye flour and chopped red onions. I made it several times and we loved it, but I have lost the recipe when I tried to change computers and put all the stuff from one hard disk to another. It came out gibberish. I would love to have the recipe again. I have looked in all the CIA cookbooks I could find, but it is not there. Can anyone help me? I would be ever so grateful. Marilyn Warren British Columbia, Canada --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n053.8 --------------- From: Frank.Yuhasz@pentairpump.com Subject: Excess Moisture Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 12:30:31 -0400 With high humidity, you can expect to add more flour than in a drier climate. Check the accuracy of your liquid measuring cup - it may not be calibrated correctly. I helped a friend who was having the same problem here in Ohio - and it turned out that her cheapie off-brand glass liquid measure held 25% more than my Pyrex one. (Moral: you get what you pay for !) Also, use an unbleached flour that has enough protein (potential for gluten development) for the kind of bread you're making. All-purpose would likely be fine for a soft dinner roll, but bread flour would do better for a crusty sourdough. Happy baking ! Carolyn --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n053.9 --------------- From: Elisabeth Keene Subject: Answer to Excerpt from a book Date: Sat, 22 Jul 2000 18:36:59 -0700 (PDT) Hello, Sorry I can't write at great length here today, but I think you will find most of the answers to your questions in a WONDERFUL book by Elizabeth David called English Bread and Yeast Cookery. It may be out of print as it was published about 25 years ago for the first time, but as she is a classic cookery writer in Britain, it may be available as a paperback from Penguin. It is a very comprehensive book about bread cookery in the British Isles and as you are obviously interested in bread, you would find it very interesting anyway! I'm from Britain, and as I live in Tokyo I can't get good bread, and her book has helped me a lot. Elisabeth Keene __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get Yahoo! Mail ­ Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n053.10 --------------- From: Andie Paysinger Subject: Cleaning grinders after coffee Date: Sat, 22 Jul 2000 21:22:03 -0700 Coffee or spices can indeed leave their essence in grinders. However there is a way to get them free of the taste/scent. Put 2 or 3 tablespoons of dry baking soda in the grinder along with 3 saltine crackers. buzz it about for at least 30 seconds, shaking the grinder up & down while it is running. Occasionally you might have to repeat the process but it works. for burr grinders (the kind that the material runs through from a hopper into a receptacle, mix baking soda with white rice so you have at least 1/2 a cup (half & half) and run that through the grinder. This is good for cleaning the grinder after processing oily nuts or very oily grains or legumes. -- Andie Paysinger & the PENDRAGON Basenjis,Teafer,Cheesy,Singer & Player asenji@earthlink.net So. Calif. USA "In the face of adversity, be patient, in the face of a basenji, be prudent, be canny, be on your guard!" http://home.earthlink.net/~asenji/ --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n053.11 --------------- From: Jessica Weissman Subject: excess moisture - measuring error? Date: Mon, 24 Jul 2000 09:04:03 -0400 (EDT) With regard to the excess moisture, have you checked to make sure that you are measuring correctly and that your measuring cup is not off? Since you have to add more to all recipes, maybe the measurements themselves are off. Lots of the large liquid measures I've seen are off by a good bit. And are you sighting the measurement at eye level, and using the bottom of the meniscus (dip in the surface) as your mark? In a wide measure the difference between the top of the meniscus (sighting against the side of the cup) and the bottom could be significant. >--------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n052.11 --------------- From: Jesse Wasserman Subject: Excess Moisture Can anyone explain why whenever I follow a bread recipe some how the dough always becomes slack and I have to add more flour than the recipe calls for. I know that Florida is very humid but I cant believe that is the cause?? I just finished a recipe for a sourdough oatmeal bread from Bernard Clayton's book and instead of 5-6 cups of flour I had to add well over 7 cups. Fortunately the breads turned out well but I ended up with 4 :breads instead of 3. --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n053.12 --------------- From: Reggie Dwork Subject: Finnish Rye Bread Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 18:50:28 -0700 There are a few Rye breads on the web site. You can search there. Here is one that might meet your friend's memories. * Exported from MasterCook * Finnish Rye Bread Recipe By : Serving Size : 16 Preparation Time :0:00 Categories : Bread-Bakers Mailing List Breads Grains Hand Made Amount Measure Ingredient -- Preparation Method -------- ------------ -------------------------------- 1 1/2 C Beer, buttermilk, milk -- or Water (Water Reserved From Cooking) 2 Tbsp Butter or margarine 1 Tsp Salt 1 Pkg Dry Yeast -- About 1 Tbsp 1/2 C Warm water 1 Tbsp Sugar 2 C Dark rye flour or light rye -- Flour Or Rye Meal Or With Bran) 3 1/2 To 4 Cups Unbleached White Flour Will have a more or less sour taste, depending whether it is made with beer, buttermilk, potato water, or milk, in that order. Heat 1 1/2 cups liquid to lukewarm. Stir in the butter and salt. Set aside to cool. Dissolve the yeast in the warm water (a temperature comfortable on the inside of the wrist) with the sugar. Let stand for 5 minutes or until the yeast bubbles. Stir the yeast mixture into the cooled liquid. Add the rye flour and beat until smooth. Add the white flour, a cup at a time, stirring after each addition until enough is added to make a stiff dough. Dust a work surface with white flour. Form the dough into a rough ball, place it on the work surface, cover it with a damp cloth, and let it rest for 15 minutes. Generously butter a large bowl or pot. Adding only as much flour as necessary to prevent sticking, knead the bread dough until smooth, about 5 minutes. (The gluten in rye is more fragile than in wheat. It needs a resting time to recuperate and reform and does not need as lengthy or vigorous a kneading). Form the dough into a smooth ball and place it in a buttered bowl, turning it to coat all sides with the butter. Cover it and let it rise in a warm spot until doubled in size, about 2 hours. Punch the dough down, gently knead it for one minute, and divide it into two parts. Form each half into a round loaf and place the loaves in two lightly buttered 9-inch round cake pans or on a large, buttered baking sheet. Press a hole through the center of each loaf to give it a traditional shape if you wish. Cover and let rise until almost doubled in size, about 1/2 hour. Preheat the oven to 375F. BRush the loaves with water and gently puncture the surface all over with the tines of a fork, in a design if you wish. Bake for about 30 minutes or until the bread is golden brown and sounds hollow when tapped on the bottom. While it is hot, brush it with butter to glaze, and then let it cool on a rack. Yields 2 round loaves. >From: SUNDAYS AT MOOSEWOOD RESTAURANT, Simon & Schuster/ Fireside, New York - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v100.n053.13 --------------- From: Ed Okie Subject: bread temperature, another perspective Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2000 08:43:29 -0400 Last week's bread-bakers e-mail list included several questions (and answers) about the proper temperature for baking bread. Example: > I'd like some advice on the proper internal temperature for bread when > baking in the oven. I am never sure if it is completely done inside & > often wind up either over or under baking. I have a instant read > thermometer & would like to know what temperature bread should be to be > done. Judged simply by the number of times this question is asked, and the numerous replies that inevitably follow, suggests that the subject deserves further scrutiny. Consider this perspective: The oft-mentioned 190-degree figure is widely touted as "the benchmark" if not "the gospel." The Cook's Bible says so, including many other publications. Yet, the question steps beyond baking - an issue where art, science and old cookbook-tales clash (thumping a loaf with your knuckles and listening for a hollow sound is always worth a laugh). Be it 190 or 195, the motherly advice, by implication, suggests: "Do this and you will achieve perfection." Unfortunately, following that advice is as much a handicap, as it is an aid toward developing baking skills. Frankly, I started out following the widely-touted 190-advice; first by using an el-cheap-o barely readable dial thermometer, then advancing to a "good" $10 Taylor dial thermometer, followed by a precision instant-read Thermapen $60 electronic digital tool bought from the King Arthur catalog. Long story short: After months of plying, probing and trying, I ended up with many notes, lots of temperature numbers... but really didn't make much progress in baking quality bread! Determined to succeed, I probed King Arthur's baking guru P.J. Hamel, who referred me to resident KA baking pro Jeffrey Hamelman (a very successful former commercial baker). Jeff offered me some feather-ruffling advice by effectively saying "I don't use a thermometer, never have, wouldn't even know what to do with it..." "Say what?" was my first reaction! Don't even use a thermometer? Ya' gotta' be kiddin'? But all the books and advisors say I'm supposed to! At first I thought Jeff was being a bit crusty with his reply... the polished pro talking down to green-horn beginner-kid. Equally disconcerting, Jeff's advice seemed far too simple: Bake by the color of the loaf, i.e., use your eyes, not some mechanical tool! Eventually, and somewhat reluctantly (minus $70 later in tools), I came to appreciate that ol'-Jeff knows what he's talking about! Forget the tool. Forget the oft-propagated ol-wives' tale about 190, 195 (or whatever). Instead, use your eyes - bake by the color of bread. After a few trial-&-error attempts you'll become a better baker. Yes, start with a specific baking time, but use your eyes (loaf color) as the final "when to pull" judgement. Don't keep opening the oven door trying to check bread temperatures. (Don't have a see-through door? Put that on your wish-list, and an oven that is a convection unit.) The confusing part of the 190-degree advice (if not misappropriated advice) is forgotten basic science. To wit: Bread's internal temperature can't rise above 210-212 degrees despite 400-450 degree surrounding oven air temperatures... until all the water evaporates. (And when that occurs the loaf becomes inedible "toast!") It is the same science principle about boiling water in a pot can't exceed 210-212 degrees, until it evaporates. Particularly frustrating when trying to measure bread's temperature is that the increase from say, 185 to the 210-212 disaster level doesn't progress in uniform minute-by-minute steps. In tech-talk: the temperature change isn't "linear." It creeps slowly upward, then once the water evaporates the bread temperature skyrockets. Another thermometer measurement problem is that we are indirectly measuring water content, not temperature, per se. Adding to the problem: bread's very, very open physical structure doesn't provide an adequate contact surface for the measuring probe. Compare bread's open structure to that of meat, an object that we can accurately measure because meat has a solid physical core. The one instance I've come across where thermometer use may apply is when the bread comes out of the oven - if you want, check it as a reference point. If the core temperature is decidedly low (155-185) - that is valid information: put it back in the oven! In summary: the advice about baking bread to 190-degrees... take it with the proverbial grain of salt. The best idea, use Jeff's KISS formula: Keep It Simple, Stupid. Use your eyes. Bake by the color. - Ed Okie --------------- END bread-bakers.v100.n053 --------------- Copyright (c) 1996-2000 Regina Dwork and Jeffrey Dwork All Rights Reserved