Date: Sun, 17 Jan 1999 01:20:06 -0800 (PST) -------------- BEGIN bread-bakers.v099.n004 -------------- 001 - C&D - Whey 002 - "Combar, Curt (MCI)" Subject: Poolish 009 - Larry Tannenbaum Subject: Whey Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1998 08:16:50 -0800 I have never used whey (except in a nursery rhyme) - what is it exactly? Can it be omitted or are there substitutions? Thanks, Catherine --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v099.n004.2 --------------- From: "Combar, Curt (MCI)" Subject: Quaker Grain Mill Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 08:23:23 -0700 Hi all, I am trying to locate a source for the Quaker City Grain Mill, a hand-operated grain mill. Please email me directly if possible! Thanks! Curt Curt Combar MCI WorldCom Colorado Springs, CO, USA curt.combar@mci.com --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v099.n004.3 --------------- From: "Sue & Sam Hurwitz" Subject: biga Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 08:03:46 -0500 >From what I have observed, the biga is used mainly in Italian bread baking. I find that it is great. I am not always fooling around with the sour of the culture of the sourdough. This I can freeze and use dependably later on. It takes only a day or two to prepare. I have used it with about six different recipes of various white breads, whole wheat, and challah - and it has been dependable for me. Somewhere or other I found an Italian bulletin board and got a number of their recipes using this ingredient. --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v099.n004.4 --------------- From: Lydia Lindsay Subject: Oster Bread Machine Problems Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 21:28:51 -0500 (EST) Karin, I have an Oster ABM as well. At first it was making great loaves of bread. And then I got duds. I tested my yeast, which was good. I messed around with the ingredients to no avail. Then I went and purchased a good set of measuring cups and spoons and meticulously followed the recipes in the book. Voila! I have been having great loaves again. It seems that I was being sloppy in my measuring and that was throwing my recipes off. Bread baking is such a delicious science. Lydia --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v099.n004.5 --------------- From: Geraldine Tulane Subject: need a pie recipe Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 20:20:29 -0500 [Editor's Note: Please send this info directly to Jheri not to the list...thanks, Reggie] I realize "pie" is not "bread" but I'm desperate to find this recipe, after trying everything else I can think of. It's for Skoog Pie...anyone ever heard of it? Also, if anyone can tell me how to download a recipe from this list into my Master Cook Cookbook I would appreciate it Also, along this same vein, I have copied many recipes onto 3.5" disk and would like to transfer them into my MC program...can I do this? Thanks.......Jheri --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v099.n004.6 --------------- From: KSBAUM@aol.com Subject: Thank you Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 16:36:10 EST Thanks to everyone for their helpful replies to my post about my Oster bread machine troubles. I've been tinkering with a basic white bread recipe to get the optimum balance of ingredients. For a loaf that has 3 c. flour, I use about 3/4 tsp. of yeast (Red Star active dry), a generous tsp. of salt, 8 oz. water or warm milk, 1 tsp. sugar, and a generous tsp. of Lora Brody's Bread Dough Enhancer. This last really makes all difference - it's magic stuff. The loaf rose high and stayed that way throughout baking. The finished bread looked great and had a texture that I prefer - not too squishy. Again many thanks to everyone for their help. I'm going to tackle whole wheat bread next and will keep you posted. Karin Baumgardner Issaquah, WA --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v099.n004.7 --------------- From: "Jazzbel" Subject: Oster Bread Machine Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 09:12:37 -0500 I live at sea level and have had an oster since November, 2.5 pounds size and have gotten wonderful bread from it. I would try to contact the manufacturer, and also ask someone in your area with a BM to compare notes. You should also: 1) test your yeast. 2) try to adjust liquid/flour ratios. While trying to determine whether the machine is faulty, try baking white breads on it. Sometimes, certain ingredients, such as garlic, produce flat tops. Also WW, rye and other flour with lower gluten content could affect your results. Later, Jazzbel >>>>> Give me, for a beautiful sight, a neat and smart woman, heating her oven and setting in her bread! And, if the bustle does make the sign of labour glisten on her brow, where is the man that would not kiss that off, rather than lick the plaster from the cheek of a duchess? -- William Cobbet, The Cottage Economy(1821) >>>>> --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v099.n004.8 --------------- From: Mitch Smith Subject: > Subject: Poolish Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 17:02:19 -0600 "Bob Leonard, Jr." wrote: >Is this the equivalent of the Italian "Biga"? It seems >similar. The biga can be frozen to use later. Is this just >to be used immediately? I have only used a biga once (with >so-so results) and would like to know more about it if >anyone has any info on that process. Essentially the same process. The fairly liquid nature of the batter permits a much more active yeast culture than a stiffer dough made at the start. While it has different names in different cultures and settings, the idea and process is the same - give the yeast a running start. It can be used with almost any bread from bagels on down the list. >I would also ask if this could be used without an ABM but I >will have found that out before you could reply. I intend >to do just that today. I've never used an ABM, so can't answer with certainty. I would think you could certainly do the poolish in a separate bowl, let it rise, and then add to the ABM with the rest of the ingredients. Whether you can make the initial poolish in the ABM itself would depend on the flexibility of the machine's cycles. --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v099.n004.9 --------------- From: Larry Tannenbaum Subject: Range info Date: Mon, 11 Jan 99 08:56:51 -0800 Margaret: In the area where I live, the gas company has a demonstration kitchen. Anyone can make an appointment and try out (actually cook your own recipes) many different gas ranges and ovens, etc. for free. You might to check with the gas company in your area. Larry >From: Margaret Maurer >Subject: The 6-burner-range-of-my-dreams >Date: Fri, 08 Jan 1999 21:19:50 -0500 > >Many thanks to everyone who responded so promptly last year when we >asked for recommendations on bread machines. Based on your comments we >went out and bought a zoe and we've had a wonderful relationship for the >last year. > >Now we're remodeling our kitchen and are actually contemplating spending >more money on a 6-burner-range-of-our-dreams than some people spend on >an automobile. The problem is that unlike when you purchase a car, they >don't let you test out the ranges in the store - I can't see how long it >takes to boil a pot of water, or how evenly the oven bakes. Does anyone >want to recommend any specific brands? We're looking the >quasi-professional range, and are even considering one of those new >dual-fuel ranges. BTW - it's gas or nothing on the cooktop. Anybody >have a stove that they don't think we should buy? Do you love your >stove? Tell us why - please - I just don't want to buy a dog and spend >a whole lot of money on it. --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v099.n004.10 --------------- From: "Russell J. Fletcher" Subject: RE: Oster Bread Machine Problems - Help Needed Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 22:00:24 -0800 I use an Oster machine with very few problems. Here are some hints for high altitude baking Russ * Exported from MasterCook II * High Altitude Bread Baking Tips Recipe By : Oster Deluxe Bread and Dough Maker, (1997) Serving Size : 1 Preparation Time :0:00 Categories : Cooking Tips Amount Measure Ingredient -- Preparation Method -------- ------------ -------------------------------- Text on high altitude bread baking below "At high altitudes above 3,000 feet, dough rises faster. Therefore, when baking at high altitudes some experimentation is required. Follow the suggested guidelines. Use one suggestion at a time and remember to write down which suggestions work best for you. Guidelines: 1. Reduce the amount of yeast by 25%. this will inhibit the bread from over rising. 2. Increase salt by 25%. The bread will rise slower and have less of a tendency to sink. 3. Watch your dough as it mixes. Flour stored at High Altitudes tends to be drier. You might add a few tablespoons of water, until the dough forms a nice ball." formatted by Russell Fletcher gimplimp@teleport.com - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - --- Russell Fletcher GIMPLIMP@TELEPORT.COM > I received an Oster bread machine for Christmas this year, and have been > experimenting with it daily since then - with limited success. > Almost every loaf rises and then collapses when baking. I have reduced the > amount of yeast and sugar and now the loaves are just flattened on top. I live at > about 1500 feet - could this be the trouble? I checked out a couple books from our > library and it seems that every machine has its own quirks. Any > help would be much appreciated. TIA > > Karin Baumgardner > Issaquah, WA --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v099.n004.11 --------------- From: "tess@shore.intercom.net" Subject: Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 10:37:22 -0500 (EST) A wonderful flat bread. * Exported from MasterCook * Cheese And Herb Flat Bread Recipe By : Jo Anne Merrill Serving Size : 2 Preparation Time :2:00 Categories : Breads Amount Measure Ingredient -- Preparation Method -------- ------------ -------------------------------- 1 Package yeast 1/4 Cup warm water 2 Tablespoons margarine 1 Tablespoon sugar 1 1/2 Teaspoons salt 3/4 Cup milk -- scalded 3 Cups all-purpose flour 2 Tablespoons onions -- chopped 1/4 Cup margarine -- melted 1/2 Teaspoon oregano 1/2 Teaspoon paprika 1/4 Teaspoon celery seed 1/4 Teaspoon garlic salt 1/2 Teaspoon basil 1 Cup cheddar cheese -- shredded 1. Soften yeast in 1/4 cup warm water. 2. In mixing bowl, combine 2 tablespoons margarine, sugar, salt and scalded milk. Cool to lukewarm. 3. Stir the yeast into milk mixture. Gradually add flour to form a stiff dough. You may not need all of the flour. Knead on floured surface until smooth and satiny; 4 to 5 minutes. Place in greased bowl and turn to coat top. Cover and let rise until light; about 45 minutes. 4. Divide dough in half. Press each piece into a 9-inch pie or cake pan. 5. Combine onions, 1/4 cup melted margarine, oregano, paprika, celery seed, garlic salt and basil. Spread over dough. Sprinkle evenly with cheese. Prick each with fork in several places. 6. Let rise for about 30 minutes or until light. 7. Bake in preheated 375-degree oven for 20 to 25 minutes until golden brown. Serve while still warm. Yield: two 9-inch flat breads. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Serving Ideas : Try this with a salad, lasagna or spaghetti with sauce. NOTES : made this exactly as recipe requested on 1/8/99. Excellent --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v099.n004.12 --------------- From: "Jim Patelli" Subject: Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 11:58:37 -0500 I recently received the following recipe from Martha Stewart and would like to know if I can convert it and use the dough cycle instead doing it by hand. PANETTONE (Italian fruitcake Makes 3 small loafs) 2 packages (2 1/2 teaspoons each) active dry yeast 4 cups all-purpose flour 1/2 cup warm milk 2/3 cup sugar 4 large eggs 2 large egg yolks 1 tsp vanilla extract 1 1/2 sticks unsalted butter 2 cups mixed dried and candied fruit Zest of 1 lemon Zest of 1 orange Three 3 3/8-by-7 1/2-inch brown paper bags 2 Tbs. melted butter, for bags 1 large egg yolk mixed with 1 tablespoon heavy cream, for egg wash 1. To make the sponge, warm a small bowl by rinsing it with hot water. Pour in 1/3 cup warm water, and sprinkle 1 package yeast on top. Let stand until yeast has dissolved. Stir in 1/2 cup flour, cover with plastic wrap, and let stand for 30 minutes, or until doubled. 2. Sprinkle remaining yeast over warm milk. Let stand until dissolved. 3. Beat together sugar, eggs, egg yolks, and vanilla. Mix in yeast-milk mixture. Add sponge, and stir until well-incorporated. 4. Combine butter and remaining 3 1/2 cups flour until crumbly. Slowly pour in egg mixture, and beat on high speed for 3 to 4 minutes, until dough is elastic-looking and long strands form. Beat in fruit and zest. Turn dough into an oiled bowl, cover with plastic wrap, and leave in a warm place to rise until doubled, 2 to 3 hours. 5. Fold down bags to form a 3-inch cuff. Brush inside and out with melted butter. 6. Turn out dough onto a lightly floured board, and knead a few times to deflate. Divide dough into 3 pieces. Roll each into a ball, and drop into prepared bags. Place bags on a baking sheet about 4 inches apart, and cover loosely with plastic wrap. Leave in a warm place to rise until doubled again, about 2 hours. 7. Heat oven to 400 degrees. Carefully cut an "X" in the top of each loaf with oiled scissors. Brush tops lightly with egg wash. Place baking sheet in bottom third of oven. After 10 minutes, lower heat to 375 degrees. Bake for 30 more minutes; if tops get too brown while baking, cover with foil. Loaves are done when a wooden skewer inserted into centers comes out clean. Cool on a wire rack. Should be an easier way. Need all the help I can get. Thanks, Jim Patelli --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v099.n004.13 --------------- From: "J. Mathew" Subject: RECIPE: Ciabatta with Olives and Italian Herbs Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 07:22:40 -0600 Recently I've been extremely busy with work, studies, etc., and this bread has become one of my "easy favorites" to make. The sponge can be made ahead of time, and I've left it in the refrigerator for as long as a week and had great results. It is super-easy to make, requiring a single rise before it gets popped into the oven. I highly recommend a baking stone for this bread, because it gets a wonderful crust and puffs up very nicely when baked directly on the stone. The shaping of the bread is also relatively freeform, and I've divided the dough into 2-4 portions, resulting in round, oval, or squarish shaped "loaves". If you want to make a kind of "plain" bread that's good for toast and jelly, butter, honey, etc., you can simply omit the herbs, onion, and olives. Enjoy! Joan -- Reply via email to joanm@bigfoot.com http://www.bigfoot.com/~joanm ************************************************************ Ciabatta with Olives and Italian Herbs Makes: 2 loaves Sponge: 1 c. bread flour 2 t. sugar 2-1/2 t. active dry yeast 3/4 c. warm water (approx. 110-120 degrees -- warm to the wrist) Blend ingredients together thoroughly in medium bowl. Cover; place in refrigerator for 12-24 hours, or up to 1 week. Bread: Sponge starter (preferably at room temperature) 4 c. bread flour 1 to 1-1/4 c. warm water (approx. 110-120 degrees -- warm to the wrist) 2 t. powdered milk 1/4 t. ground ginger 1/4 t. ground cayenne pepper 2-1/2 t. active dry yeast 1 t. salt 4-6 T. Italian herbs (I like to use a mixture of oregano, basil, and thyme -- you can use fresh, chopped herbs or dried herbs) 1/4 c. minced dried onions (optional) 2.25 oz. can of sliced ripe olives, well drained 2 T. bread or all-purpose flour Preheat oven to 425 degrees Fahrenheit (400 if using convection). In a large mixing bowl, combine all bread ingredients (sponge through ripe olives) and knead for 7-9 minutes. Turn dough out onto a floured work surface and divide into two equal portions (you may also make 4 individual-sized bread loaves). The dough will be sticky and soft, so you may wish to flour your hands before working with the dough. Roll each portion into a roughly oval shape approximately 3/4" thick. These breads are more beautiful if they are shaped irregularly. Dust loaves lightly with flour. Place loaves on a baking sheet sprinkled lightly with cornmeal. Let rise for 20-30 minutes until doubled in thickness and puffy. Bake for 25-27 minutes until loaves are slightly browned on top and sound hollow when tapped. Remove from oven; cool on wire rack. NOTE: these loaves are excellent when used for sandwiches or "quick" pizzas. For sandwiches: slice loaf in half horizontally; toast lightly. Top one half with sandwich filling, place other half on top. Serve. For quick pizzas: brush very lightly with olive oil and other pizza toppings (cheese, tomato sauce, pepperoni, chopped fresh vegetables, herbs) and place under broiler until cheese is melted and bubbly. Serve immediately. Recipe also posted on my recipe archive: http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/8098/recipes.html --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v099.n004.14 --------------- From: JPellegrino Subject: Arugula Watercress Flatbread Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 19:19:07 -0600 Here is an interesting green colored bread from Mark Miller's Coyote Cafe. It can be made by hand or in the abm. I x-posted at an earlier date to RecipeCafe and FareShare. JoAnn * Exported from MasterCook * Arugula Watercress Flatbread (Mark Miller's Coyote Cafe) Recipe By : Mark Miller, Coyote Cafe, Santa Fe, NM Serving Size : 8 Preparation Time :0:00 Categories : Abm Breads Chefs Amount Measure Ingredient -- Preparation Method -------- ------------ -------------------------------- 3/4 cup milk 1 cup water, lukewarm 2 teaspoons active dry yeast 2 1/2 cups bread flour 2 teaspoons salt 30 arugula leaves -- coarsely chopped 20 sprigs watercress -- coarsely chopped 1. Combine the milk and 1/2 cup of the water in the bowl of a heavy duty mixer or in a large mixing bowl. 2. Sprinkle the yeast over the mixture, stir in, and let sit for 2 minutes. 3. Mix in 1 cup of the bread flour with the dough hook (or knead by hand). 5. Add the remaining 1/2 cup water, the remaining 1 1/2 cups bread flour, and salt. 6. Mix the dough hook 8-10 minutes (or by hand), or until dough appears resilient and silky. 7. Fold or knead the arugula and watercress into the dough until evenly distributed. 8. Transfer dough to a lightly oiled bowl and cover with plastic wrap. 9. Let rise in a warm place for 2 hours. 10. Turn over a baking sheet and sprinkle with cornmeal or semolina flour. 11. Place dough on a work surface generously sprinkled with semolina flour and cut in 2 equal pieces. 12. Gently pull and stretch each piece into an 8 inch round or a 7 inch square. 13. Press each flatbread into the semolina flour, then flip to coat the other side. 14. Transfer to the prepared baking sheet. 15. Cover with plastic wrap and let rise in warm place 45 minutes to 1 hour. 16. Place a baking stone on the middle rack in the oven and preheat to 450 F. 17. Using a spray bottle, spritz the oven walls with water. Work quickly so oven doesn't lose heat. 18. Slide the flatbreads onto the hot stone. 19. Bake for 14 to 16 minutes, or until the bread browns. 20. Transfer the flatbreads to a rack to cool. Yield: 2 flatbreads BREAD MACHINE INSTRUCTIONS: 1. Combine all the ingredients, except the arugula and watercress, in the bread pan in the order specified by the manufacturer's instructions. 2. Process on the dough setting. 3. When the cycle is complete, turn the dough out onto a well-floured work surface. 4. Knead the arugula and watercress into the dough until evenly distributed. 5. Continue with step 8 of the above recipe. Note: People tend to do a double take when they first set eyes on this bright green bread. When they taste it, the spicy aromatic greens have the same effect on the palate! Arugula, also called rocket, has a peppery, pleasantly savory flavor. Use it as soon as possible as it loses its spark after a day or two. Recipe from Mark Miller's Book - Flavored Breads Recipes from Mark Miller's Coyote Cafe ISBN 0 89815 862 1 Posted to RecipeCafe and FareShare 11/98 by JoAnn Pellegrino - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v099.n004.15 --------------- From: "J. Mathew" Subject: 6-burner range of your dreams Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 07:09:03 -0600 > Now we're remodeling our kitchen and are actually contemplating spending > more money on a 6-burner-range-of-our-dreams than some people spend on > an automobile. The problem is that unlike when you purchase a car, they > don't let you test out the ranges in the store - I can't see how long it > takes to boil a pot of water, or how evenly the oven bakes. Does anyone > want to recommend any specific brands? We're looking the > quasi-professional range, and are even considering one of those new > dual-fuel ranges. BTW - it's gas or nothing on the cooktop. Anybody > have a stove that they don't think we should buy? Do you love your > stove? Tell us why - please - I just don't want to buy a dog and spend > a whole lot of money on it. When my husband and I had our house built 4-1/2 years ago, we had them build it with nothing in the kitchen except the floor tile. After we closed on the house, we had our own contractors come in and install all the appliances, cupboards, and finish up the tile work on the backsplashes, etc. We installed a Viking range (more about that below), a KitchenAid wall oven, a Sub-Zero refrigerator/freezer, and a GE dishwasher. I love my kitchen (and it gets used a LOT)! To be more specific about your request, I have a 6-burner 36" Viking range with thermal/convection oven. It is a full-size range that is built into an island in our kitchen. For that reason, we have the Viking hood installed over it and mounted from the ceiling. We chose the outside venting option, so the fan is really QUIET and is hardly noticeable -- it allows for people to have conversations and to hear the radio/TV without any problems at all. We also installed a KitchenAid Superba Selectra 30, a 30" wall oven with thermal/convection oven (I wanted to find the widest oven available at the time, but didn't opt for a professional model like the Viking). I use both of them quite a lot (can you guess that I do a lot of cooking? heh), and I love both of them. I don't know how I made my bread without convection! I also love it for browning things like roast chicken, casseroles, etc. I can turn the convection on/off on both ovens, so that it bakes without that feature at any time. After installing these ovens I carefully tested the temperature settings several times over the first year. I found them to be very accurate, and they've always baked perfectly for me. I've never had any problems with odd "hot spots" in either oven, although I usually bake my breads in the big Viking oven because I can fit a lot more in there at once. Since the Viking is 36" wide, I can fit the big, professional-sized baking trays in there, and I can fit many loaves of bread in the oven simultaneously as well. The only problem we've ever had with the Viking is the igniters not working properly on the top burners. While I was cooking and the burners were on the igniters (these are electronic igniters, designed to re-light the flame if they should go out) would suddenly start snapping, trying to re-light a flame that was already on! We discovered that there is a control module that had become faulty and needed replacement. We had a Viking repairman to the house to replace this control module, and he tested the oven while he was here -- his tests confirmed that the oven was running at proper temperatures. Although that single visit cost $100 (module was about $50-60, and the visit was the other $40), we learned how to replace the igniters and the module ourselves. We replaced the module again about 3 months after that, but have had no problems with it since (about 2-1/2 years now). The problem with the igniter control module is a common one, I understand. In fact, after obtaining stories of other customer experiences through the newsgroup rec.food.equipment, we wrote a letter to Viking and included our experience along with all those other stories. They gave us a free control module when it failed that second time, and told us that it was a known problem. As far as I know, that's the only recurring problem I've heard about for the Viking stoves. Ours was purchased in 1994, so I don't know if the problem still exists. Despite the problem I described, it did not change my overall appreciation of my stove! I love that Viking stove, and don't know how I ever survived without it before! HTH, Joan -- Reply via email to joanm@bigfoot.com http://www.bigfoot.com/~joanm (NetWord: "gardngirl") --------------- END bread-bakers.v099.n004 --------------- -------------- BEGIN bread-bakers.v099.n005 -------------- 001 - "Sue & Sam Hurwitz" Subject: FlatBreads Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 08:20:49 -0500 * Exported from MasterCook * Seasoned Flat Sourdough Bread Recipe By : Serving Size : 1 Preparation Time :0:00 Categories : Bread Bread, Flat Bread, Sourdough, Amount Measure Ingredient -- Preparation Method -------- ------------ -------------------------------- ***** NONE ***** (makes 6 flat breads) 2 C unsweetened sourdough starter 1 1/2 tsp salt 1 Tbl sugar 2 Tbl vegetable oil 2 1/2 C all-purpose flour, or as needed olive oil Add salt, sugar and vegetable oil to starter. Mix thoroughly. Incorporate flour slowly into mixture until stiff. Turn onto floured board and knead in additional flour as necessary until dough is satiny. Divide dough into 6 equal parts and shape into balls. Flatten by hand and place on a lightly floured cloth. Cover and let rise 30 min. Two cooking methods are offered: 1. Preheat oven to 500 F. Transfer breads to a baking sheet or stone. Brush with olive oil. Top with sliced mozzarella cheese, tomato slices, or other vegetables. Bake 10 min or until bread is browned and cheese is bubbling. 2. Brush the bread with olive oil, season with herbs, and cook on a preheated griddle. -------------So here is the first "recipe". It is probably better suited for those who've made bread before: Dump out 1 cup starter (or more, if you've got it and want more) into a mixing bowl. Add enough flour so that the mixture is thick and *soupy*; you don't want it to congeal into a lump. If you added too much flour, mix in a little bit of water, trickling it in SLOWLY. This is the sponge, let it sit for about 24 hours. Dump in salt to your liking (I think 1 tbsp is fine, more/less depending on personal opinions). While stirring, slowly add flour until it pulls away >from the sides. At this point, flour a counter (make a mess!) and dump it out and knead. Many ways to knead, many books with advice. 99% of the methods work, so I'll not go into mine. After 5-10 minutes of kneading, or until it feels right (at this point it is like making regular bread!), form the dough into a circle, oil it, and put it into a clean bowl (maybe the same one) to rise. This will take 4-5 hours (starter is a pretty slow yeast, at least the strain I've got). Punch down, knead a bit, let rest for 10 minutes, and form loaves or put into a bread pan. I've found that oiling/buttering/whatever even the non-stick types really will make a difference. Cook for 10-30 minutes, or until it looks good. Or until you can't wait (I've never minded eating "rare" bread dough!). - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - * Exported from MasterCook * Swedish Flat Bread Recipe By : Serving Size : 1 Preparation Time :0:00 Categories : Bread Bread, Flat Bread, "Foreign" Amount Measure Ingredient -- Preparation Method -------- ------------ -------------------------------- 2 cups flour 3/4 cup rye flour 1/4 cup sufar 1/2 ts baking soda 1/2 ts salt 1 stick butter or margerine 1 cup buttermilk 2 tbsp fennel seed In a bowl, blend flour, sugar, salt and soda. Cut in margarine until mixture resembles fine crumbs. Stir in buttermilk and add fennel seeds, sing a fork, just until mixture holds together. Shape into small balls and roll on floured board to make very thin rounds four to five inches in diameter. Bake on ungreased sheets at 375F five minutes or until light - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - * Exported from MasterCook * Torta sul Testo Recipe By : Italian Web Site Serving Size : 1 Preparation Time :0:00 Categories : Bread Bread, Flat Bread, Italian Amount Measure Ingredient -- Preparation Method -------- ------------ -------------------------------- 3 3/4 cups flour 2 tsp baking powder 1 tsp salt 1 1/3 cups water Mix with enough water to form soft dough. Gently kenad until smooth. Divide into 4 pieces. Roll or stretch each piece until 10-12" round. Riddle with fork tines. Heat black cast iron pan hot enough so that flour will darken, but not burn. Place disk in pan and let heat one one side - then turn it over. Dough is ready when little charred bubbles form on surface. Can serve this way or with filler i.e., salami, sauted greens. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - * Exported from MasterCook * Zaatar Flat Bread Recipe By : Serving Size : 1 Preparation Time :0:00 Categories : Bread Bread, Fancy Bread, Flat Bread, "Foreign" Amount Measure Ingredient -- Preparation Method -------- ------------ -------------------------------- 1/4 cup zaatar spices 1/2 tsp kosher salt 2 lemons juice 3/4 cu virgin olive oil FOR BREAD 1 tbsp yeast 2 cups water 2 tsp sugar 2 tbsp extra virgin olive oil 1 3/4 tsp kosher salt 2 cups flour ap 5 cups bread flour For topping: Stir zaatar spices, salt lemon juice and olive oil in small bowl and set aside. For bread: whisk together yeast, water and sugar. Stir in oil, salt, all purpose flour and most of bread flour - reserve 1 cup. Mix to form a soft dough. Knead 8 - 10 minutes add reserve flour as necessary. Place dough in well greased bowl, cover with plastic and tea towel and let rise till doubled. OR a long cool rise in refrigerator for several hours or overnight. Dough keeps for 3 days. If refrigerated, let assume room temperature. Break off sections of dough about size of grapefruit. Stretch or roll into irregular slabs. Let rest 15 minutes, cover with damp tea towel. Smear, spoon or brush each with some of olive oil zaatar mixture. Preheat grill to hottest temperature. Lay slabs gently on grill. Cover for 1-2 minutes, then check to gauge doneness. Allow to bake until tops begin to brown. Brush with additional topping if desired. To cook over charcoal grill, watch out for hot spots. Start checking slabs of dough after just 1 minute to ensure that they are not burning. Zaatar Spice 2 tsp ground oregano 2 tbsp ground thyme 2 tsp whole dried oregano 2 tsp ground savory 2 tsp ground marjoram ½ tsp whole leaf dried marjoram 1 tbsp sumac (optional) ½ cup sesame seeds 1 ½ tsp kosher salt zest 2 lemons finely minced. Blend together both oreganos, both thymes, savory, marjoram, sumac, sesame seeds, salt and lemon zest. Use for zaatar flatbread. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v099.n005.2 --------------- From: JPellegrino Subject: Re: Request for German Black Rye Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 10:12:48 -0600 Becky requested a German Black Rye bread. I couldn't find the exact recipe but these might be helpful. JoAnn * Exported from MasterCook * Russian Black Bread (Rye) - Bernard Clayton Recipe By : Bernard Claytons New Complete Book of Breads Serving Size : 1 Preparation Time :0:00 Categories : Breads Amount Measure Ingredient -- Preparation Method -------- ------------ -------------------------------- 2 packages dry yeast 3 1/2 cups bread flour OR all-purpose flour 4 cups pumpernickel flour OR medium rye flour 1 tablespoon salt 2 cups whole bran cereal 2 tablespoons caraway seeds -- crushed 1 tablespoon instant coffee 1 tablespoon onion powder 1 teaspoon fennel seeds -- crushed 2 1/2 cups water 1/4 cup cider vinegar 1/4 cup dark molasses 1 ounce unsweetened chocolate (1 square) 1/4 cup shortening 1 teaspoon cornstarch (mixed in 1/2 cup cold water) Baking Pans or Sheet: Two 8" cake pans, greased; or, if the dough is fairly stiff and will hold shape, use 1 baking sheet, greased or Teflon. By Hand or Mixer, 20 minutes: In a large mixing or mixer bowl mix the yeast, 1 cup white and 1 cup pumpernickel or rye flour, salt, bran cereal, caraway, instant coffee, onion powder, and fennel. In a saucepan, combine the water, vinegar, molasses, chocolate, and shortening. Place over low heat. When the liquid is warm (the chocolate and shortening need only be soft), add to the dry ingredients. Beat at medium speed with the flat beater for 2 minutes, scraping the bowl occasionally. Add 1 cup white flour and 1 cup rye flour. Beat for 2 minutes, or about 100 strokes with a wooden spoon. Stir in 2 more cups rye flour and enough white flour to make a soft dough. Work the flour into the dough first with a wooden spoon or dough hook, and then turn out to work with your fingers and hands. Rest 15 minutes: Before kneading, cover the dough with the bowl and lest it rest for 15 minutes. Kneading 8 minutes: Knead by hand or with the mixer dough hook until the dough is smooth and elastic. If the dough is sticky, dust it and your hands with flour. Scrape away any sticky film that forms on the work surface, and dust it afresh. The dough should pull away and clean the sides of the bowl. First Rising 1 Hour: Place the dough in a bowl, cover tightly with plastic wrap, and leave at room temperature until puffy and doubled in bulk, 1 hour.( If prepared with the new fast-rising yeast at the recommended higher temperatures, reduce the rising time by half.) Shaping 10 minutes: Punch down the dough with the fingers and turn out onto a lightly floured work surface. Cut the dough into 2 pieces and let the dough rest for 5 minutes. Shape each piece into a ball, flatten slightly, and place either in the cake pan or on a baking sheet. Second Rising 45 minutes: Cover with waxed paper and leave at room temperature until the loaves have doubled in bulk, 45 minutes. Preheat: Preheat the oven to 350F about 20 minutes before baking. Baking 350F 1 hour: Bake for about 1 hour, or until a metal skewer inserted in the center of a loaf comes out dry and clean. When tapped on the bottom crust, it will sound hard and hollow. Meanwhile, prepare the glaze. In a small saucepan heat the cornstarch and cold water. Cook over medium heat, stirring constantly, until the mixture boils. Hold the boil for 1 minute, stirring all the while. When the bread is baked, remove from the oven and brush the loaves with the cornstarch mixture. Place back in the oven for about 3 minutes, or until the glaze has set. (If using a convection oven, reduce the heat 40F.) Final Step: Remove the bread from the oven, turn from the baking sheet or pan, and place on a metal rack to cool. Recipe from Bernard Clayton's New Complete Book of Breads, page 144 ISBN 0 671 60222 5 Typed into MC and posted to Bread Bakers 1/99 by JoAnn Pellegrino - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - European Black Bread - ABM Submitted by: Jan This is a black bread recipe for bread machines. 7/8 cup water 3/4 teaspoon cider vinegar 1 1/2 cups bread flour 1/2 cup rye flour 1/4 cup oat bran 1 tablespoon butter or margarine 1 1/2 tablespoons white sugar 1 teaspoon salt 1 teaspoon caraway seeds 1 teaspoon dried minced onion 2 tablespoons cocoa 1 teaspoon active dry yeast Place the ingredients in the pan of the bread machine in the order suggested by the manufacturer. Select Normal setting, an then press Start. Makes 1 - 1 pound loaf Reicpe from http://www.breadrecipe.com/az/EuropeanBlackBread.asp - - - - - Russian Black Bread - ABM Submitted by: Mary I have been looking for a good Russian Black Bread recipe. This one is the closest I have come. The vinegar adds a bit of a bite, but believe me, with cheese it is marvelous. (Mary) 1 1/2 cups water 2 tablespoons cider vinegar 2 1/2 cups bread flour 1 cup rye flour 1 teaspoon salt 2 tablespoons butter or margarine 2 tablespoons dark corn syrup 1 tablespoon brown sugar 3 tablespoons cocoa 1 teaspoon instant coffee powder 1 tablespoon caraway seeds 1/4 teaspoon fennel seeds (optional) 2 teaspoons active dry yeast Place ingredients into the bread machine in order suggested by the manufacturer. Use the whole wheat, regular crust setting. After the baking cycle ends, remove bread from pan, place on a cake rack, and allow to cool for 1 hour before slicing. Makes 1 1 1/2 pound loaf Recipe from http://www.breadrecipe.com/az/RussianBlackBread.asp - - - - - Black Rye Bread 2 packs dry or two tbls fresh yeast 3 cups warm (115-degree) water 2 tsp salt 1/2 cup shortening 1/4 cup molasses 4 cups white flour 3-1/2 cups Dark Rye flour 2 Tbls cocoa powder Dissolve yeast in one cup warm (115-degree) water. Mix white flour and rye flour until rye is all through the white flour. Place remaining water, molasses, shortening, salt and cocoa powder in bowl, mix well. Add yeast, mix and add four cups of mixed flours. Mix until sponge forms. Add remaining flour and mix until all flour is incorporated. Turn out on well- floured surface and hand-knead until dough is smooth and doesn't stick to hands. Place in greased bowl and cover with towel until double in bulk. Punch dough down and knead until smooth. Divide into loaves and place in greased pans, cover and let rise while oven heats to 350 degrees. Bake in center of oven until done, about 35 minutes. Remove from pans and rub tops of loaves with butter. Makes two large loaves. Recipe from http://www.gatewayno.com/cuisine/recipes/breads/blackryebread.html - - - - - Lynn's adapt of Bernard Clayton's Triple Rye TRIPLE RYE BREAD (Adaptation Bernard Clayton) Rye developed as a "weed" in the wheat fields and would grow under the cold, damp conditions of Northern Europe where wheat would not always do well. As a result, eastern and northeastern countries have developed a fine repertoire of rye loaves. This recipe is adapted from Bernard Clayton's Triple Rye Bread recipe. Sour: 2 cups rye flour 1 cup rye flakes 2 packages dry yeast 2 cups hot water (120-130F) Sprouts: 1/2 cup rye berries 3 cups water Dough: 1 cup hot water (120-130F) 1/4 cup molasses 1 tablespoon salt 4-41/2 cups bread flour SPROUT THE RYE GRAINS To grow sprouts, measure the rye berries into a medium bowl and cover with water. Put aside to soak for 8 - 12 hours. Drain. Cover the bowl with tight-fitting plastic wrap and leave to sprout for 24 hours. The sprouts will be small, just peeking out. MAKE THE SOUR To make the sour, pour the rye flour and rye flakes into a medium bowl. Add yeast and hot water, mix well and cover with plastic wrap. Set aside to ferment overnight. MAKE THE DOUGH To make the dough, pour all of the sour into a large mixing bowl and stir in the hot water and molasses. Add the sprouts, salt and bread flour. Beat to combine thoroughly. Add the white flour, 1/2 cup at a time, to form a shaggy mass that can be lifted to the work surface. Knead the dough until smooth and elastic. FERMENT THE DOUGH Place dough in a bowl and allow to rise at room temperature until doubled in bulk (or longer if you really want a sour flavor). SHAPE THE DOUGH Divide the dough into boules and let rise until double in bulk, about 40 minutes. BAKE THE DOUGH Preheat the oven to 500F while the dough is rising. Just before putting the bread in the oven, turn the temperature down to 400F. Spritz the oven heavily with water three times during the first ten minutes of baking. Bake a total of 35-40 or until done. Recipe from http://countrylife.net/bread/recipes/770.html - - - - - --------------- END bread-bakers.v099.n005 --------------- Copyright (c) 1996-2000 Regina Dwork and Jeffrey Dwork All Rights Reserved