Date: Sat, 10 May 1997 17:24:09 -0700 (PDT) -------------- BEGIN bread-bakers.v097.n035 -------------- 001 - sam405@juno.com (Claudia - English Muffin Recipe Needed 002 - EHarbison@aol.com - salt and sugar 003 - Pekargf@aol.com - Re: Recipe Wanted 004 - Dbbr - Magic Mill Mixer 005 - John McChesney-Young Subject: Magic Mill Mixer Date: Sun, 04 May 1997 11:48:23 -0400 I was thinking of getting a Magic Mill Mixer. My Kitchen Aid has burned out a few times and I heard this mixer can do many loafs of bread without a problem. Does anyone have the Magic Mill Mixer and could you tell me if it works well? Can you use it to make cakes? I was all set to get it when I read a message at the Village Baker Web sight from someone who said her Magic Mill Mixer burned out. I e-mailed her but she never responded. Everyone else I asked about the machine said it is great but this is from people who sell the machine. I appreciate you help. Deborah --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v097.n035.5 --------------- From: John McChesney-Young Subject: Re: Grain Mills Date: Sun, 04 May 1997 14:03:06 -0800 Marta, I have a Magic Mill III Plus, which I recently bought to replace my Magic Mill II which was given to my wife and me as a wedding present. Since we received the MM II 16 years ago (plus two days :-)), it held up well through use a couple of times a week for over 15 years of making whole wheat bread. When it finally died, I called them and sent it back, although they had told me that they probably wouldn't have parts for it if it needed any. Sure enough, they couldn't fix it, but they offered me a new machine at wholesale (their policy if they can't fix one), so any thoughts of alternative machines disappeared. I had looked into the Whisper Mill though, and the obviously not disinterested woman at Magic Mill told me that the reason they're quieter is heavy insulation, which means more heat, which means quicker failure. I took it with a grain of salt, but it does stand to reason. Their address is: Magic Mill Products and Appliances 354 S. Mountain Way Dr. Orem UT 84058 I _think_ this runs about $250 list. Lehman's has 11 different mills (!) with a comparison chart of speed, effort needed, etc. They're at: P.O. Box 41 Kidron OH 44636 (330) 857-5757 E-mail: GetLehmans@aol.com They have a fantastic catalog of hardware and appliances which I highly recommend. Good baking! John --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v097.n035.6 --------------- From: casey@visionet.org (Casey Pritchard) Subject: Bread Machine yeast Date: Mon, 5 May 1997 10:44:52 -0400 Hi there! I have recently begun making bread with a bread machine, and I've noticed that some recipes specifically call for "Bread Machine yeast" (which I bought a jar of) but others either say "active dry" or do not specify. Someone told me I should *always* use "Bread Machine yeast," irregardless of what the recipe says. Does anyone agree or disgree with that? -Casey --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v097.n035.7 --------------- From: Linda Michaluk Subject: answer and question Date: Sun, 04 May 97 15:29:33 -0500 -- [ From: Linda Michaluk * EMC.Ver #2.5.02 ] -- I have lurked long enough. I have been following the postings about pizza for some time and have a suggestion about crispy crust. I do not have baking tiles or a pizza stone. What I do to get a crispy home crust is to bake it twice. The first baking is before you put on the ingredients. Bake it in a hot oven until the top is starting to get brown. Remove it from the oven, add the sauce and other ingredients and bake it again until the cheese melts and the pizza looks done to you. Sorry not to be exact but as I do this often on the Bar-B-Que, there are not exact times or temperatures. When doing this ont the barby, the grills do not need to be greased. I get the gas barby very hot and turn one side of the burners down very low, leaving the other very hot. The side that is down low is the side on which I place the pizza. On the barby takes 3 to 5 minutes. I take it off the barby (easier on the hairs on your arms), turn it over on to a cookie sheet, and proceed to put on the toppings. Back on the barby for another 5 - 8 minutes. When doing it in the oven, sometimes I turn it over before adding the toppings, and sometimes I don't. Doesn't seem to make a difference. Now for the question - I see constant reference to adding gluten to the flour for bread. I was once told that was not necessary in Canada because of the hard wheat that is used here for flour. In addition, it is easy to find, at least in my store, bread flour in both white and blended whole wheat. Any comments? Thanks for the great list. Linda --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v097.n035.8 --------------- From: QuinnF@ni.net (Quinn Farnes) Subject: Lessons learned/wind Date: Sun, 4 May 1997 22:47:37 -0700 Hi Irwin, Thank you for your comments. A couple points, though, I'd like to reiterate after the preliminaries: >You went to a lot of trouble to solve a problem Yes. As I said, I almost gave up and trashed my machine. Only the discovery of the existence of this fine list, where information is so freely exchanged, persuaded me that breadmachine-baking isn't a black art. >Someday, your could be made into a movie! Yeah, but nobody'd pay to see it, especially if Steven Seagal gets killed in the first ten minutes like he did in Executive Decision, leaving the audience with only Kurt Russel to play the persistent, if hopelessly outgunned, breadmachine-jockey. Come to think of it, that sounds like something maybe Mel Brooks would be interested in. (Darn, I'm digressing again!) >There is no doubt that the Zoji, with its two component kneading >system has superior kneading capability. The pulling and stretching of the >dough (compared to the stirring of other machines) is what develops the >gluten to the point where it produces a dough strong enough to rise >without the bubbles bursting. Understood, and I don't mean to burst your (gluten/CO2) bubble, however you recall I wrote that both the borrowed Zoji and my Goldstar produced virtually identical hockey-puck loaves until I did two things. (1) I added 1 Tbsp. gluten per cup of non-white bread flour, and, (2) I reset the machine and allowed the dough to sit for 20 minutes following the first knead (both machines white-bread cycle). I believe I read about that in the Zoji book. After making the above modifications to the baking cycle, both machines produced loaves of equivalent quality. Past experience showed me that adding gluten alone wasn't sufficient to produce an acceptable loaf; I also had to reset the machine, wait, and then restart. The improvement in texture, rise and especially flavor were significant. I suspect that it is the additional time the yeast are allowed to do their thing, as well as the additional kneading time, that turns the trick. That makes sense, because when I make bread by hand, I NEVER produce a finished loaf in only 3 hours, 40 minutes like my bread machine does. It always takes most of a day. The added gluten doesn't hurt, but by itself, it doesn't fully account for the success of the recipe in my machine, in my kitchen. I don't mean to imply that everyone should do what I've done; this just happens to have (apparently) solved my problem. Your mileage may differ, and all that. As for the Zoji, my impression is that it is a superior machine to the Goldstar, and probably to many other machines. It's quiet, powerful, smooth, apparently very well-made, and expensive. I wish I had one, but until my Goldstar dies, it'll have to wait. >It is a bread that even children who only like Wonderbread will eat! You haven't met my Gregory! He even makes me cut the crusts off Wonderbread! >Now, about pumpernickel. . .(snip). . .It produces gas, lots of >it. So I would suggest that you never eat a lot of pumpernickel in a crowd. >Especially if you are the only one eating it. Hmmm. . . both CO2 and methane (components of intestinal gas) are, so they say, Greenhouse gases, so the US EPA might be expected to either outlaw or levy a tax on the components to make pumpernickel. :-) I guess that explains why Donna G. hasn't come up with a recipe for cabbage bread, right? I made some veggie soup once. . . ONCE. . . that contained a _whole_ head of cabbage. After consuming a goodly portion, and experiencing the fulsome effects of said cabbage, I ended up feeding the remainder to the dog, then regretted it all evening! >Happy baking. Indeed I am! "Happy baking to all, and to all a good night!" (With apologies to Clement Clarke Moore) Cheers! Quinn Laguna Niguel, Calif., US of A --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v097.n035.9 --------------- From: Reggie Dwork Subject: BakerBagz Date: Sat, 10 May 1997 11:59:15 -0700 I have recently come across a product that really caught my attention. I frequently make bread to give away for presents. I always stick the loaf in a ziplock type bag or wrap it in foil. I am never happy with the appearance of the container. I have been looking and looking and finally was introduced to BakerBagz. I think they are great. They look pretty when you give them, the bread stays fresh longer because the plastic used in making the bag is at the proper respiration rate for bread. Plus if you have too much bread in your house you can store extra loaves in the bags. You can get them in a variety of designs...holiday and all occasion. There are even ties and labels that come with them. The person you need to contact is on line ... here is her name and email address: Kim Aposporos I don't work for BakerBagz and am not connected to the company in any way other then being a very satisfied customer. Reggie --------------- MESSAGE bread-bakers.v097.n035.10 --------------- From: Irwin@prodigy.com (MR IRWIN H FRANZEL) Subject: To Marta re:Grain mills Date: Fri, 9 May 1997 07:16:42, -0500 Grain mills are worth having! The quality and flavor of bread produced by grinding your own grain is much better than what can be gotten from commercially milled flour. The reason for this is that the wheat germ oil in flour you grind yourself doesn't have time to go rancid. Commercial producers either remove it or add preservatives that change (but do not improve the flavor). We tested many different mills (although not the Whisper Mill, you refer to) for our bread baking program. The one we settled on for general use is the Miracle Mill. These generally sell for $180 - $200, in health food stores. Our price for these mills is $150, delivered. Ours are sold with a satisfaction guaranteed, or your money back! The Miracle Mill is an easy to use and easy to clean machine. It has indexed settings for the fineness of grind, so that you can exactly duplicate the grind from one time to another. It is relatively quiet but I must point out that it takes a lot of energy to grind hard wheat and that does produce a significant amount of noise. Other mills we have tested produce enough noise to be potentially damaging to hearing, without protection. The Miracle Mill may be taken apart, washed and put back together with one hand. One of the most convincing reasons for buying a good mill, is to be able to bake a light, 100% whole wheat bread that we developed here at Delta Rehab. The bread has a hearty robust flavor and is made from hard, red, winter wheat. We bake these loaves on the Quick Cycle in our Zoji S-15! Irwin/Delta Rehab/Using Zojis --------------- END bread-bakers.v097.n035 --------------- Copyright (c) 1996-2000 Regina Dwork and Jeffrey Dwork All Rights Reserved