bread-bakers-digest Tuesday, 27 June 1995 Volume 06 : Number 025 Today's Subjects: [none] We're UP and baking! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: owner-bread-bakers Date: Mon, 26 Jun 1995 00:24:15 -0700 Subject: [none] The bread-bakers-digest is up and running! The next digest will be out in about seven days, sooner if the message volume is large - digests will be limited to 40,000 characters. Here's the first recipe: * Exported from MasterCook II * Anadama Bread 1 Recipe By : The Best Bread Machine Cookbook Ever, Madge Rosenberg Serving Size : 15 Preparation Time :0:00 Categories : Bread Machine Low Fat Amount Measure Ingredient -- Preparation Method - -------- ------------ -------------------------------- 1 1/2 Lb Loaf: -- (1 lb loaf) 2 1/4 Tsp Active Dry Yeast -- (1 1/2 tsp) 1 2/3 C Bread Flour -- (1 C+ 2 T) 1 1/2 C Whole-Wheat Flour -- (1 C) 1/3 C Yellow Cornmeal -- (1/4 C) 1/3 C Molasses -- unsulfured, (1/4 C) 1 1/2 Tsp Salt -- (1 t) 1 1/2 C Water -- (1C) Note: The original recipe called for 1 1/2 T vegetable oil for the lg loaf and (1T) for the smaller loaf. I omitted it. Could use Wonderslim or possibly applesauce instead. Add all ingredients in the order suggested by your bread machine manual and process on the basic bread cycle according to the manufacturer's directions. Let the loaf cool before slicing. Formatted into MasterCook II and tested for you by Reggie Dwork reggie@reggie.com - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - NOTES : Cal 128 Fat 0.6g Carbs 27.4g Dietary Fiber 2.2g Protein 4g Sodium 218mg CFF 3.9% - -- Reggie Dwork | Om Mani Padme Hung reggie@reggie.com | Owner eat-lf and bread-bakers mailing lists ------------------------------ From: reggie@reggie.com (Reggie Dwork) Date: Mon, 26 Jun 1995 00:52:03 -0700 Subject: We're UP and baking! Sorry about the missing headers on the first message. The bread-bakers-digest is up and running! Send messages to "bread-bakers@best.com". The next digest will be out in about seven days, sooner if the message volume is large - digests will be limited to 40,000 characters. Here's another recipe to make up for the missing headers: * Exported from MasterCook II * Carrot & Thyme Bread Recipe By : The Best Bread Machine Cookbook Ever, Madge Rosenberg Serving Size : 15 Preparation Time :0:00 Categories : Bread Machine Fatfree Amount Measure Ingredient -- Preparation Method - -------- ------------ -------------------------------- 1 1/2 Lb Loaf: -- (1 lb loaf) 2 1/2 Tsp Active Dry Yeast -- (1 1/2 tsp) 2 1/4 C Bread Flour -- (1 1/2 C) 1 C Rye Flour -- (2/3 C) 1/2 C Yellow Cornmeal -- (1/3 C) 1 1/2 Tbsp Sugar -- (1 T) 1 1/2 Tsp Salt -- (1 tsp) 1 1/2 Tbsp Dried Thyme -- (1 T) 2 C Carrots -- freshly grated, or -- finely chopped, -- (1 1/3 C) 1 C Water -- (1/2 C or more if -- needed) This moist multi-grain bread is excellent. It is chock full of vitamins and fiber and tastes good with fruit or vegetable salad or lentil or bean soup. Note: The original recipe called for 3 T vegetable oil for the large loaf and 2 T for the smaller loaf. Add all ingredients in the order suggested by your bread machine manual and process on the basic bread cycle according to the manufacturer's directions. Let the loaf cool before slicing. This is really good! Formatted into MasterCook II and tested for you by Reggie Dwork reggie@reggie.com - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - ------------------------------ End of bread-bakers-digest V6 #25 ********************************* bread-bakers-digest Saturday, 1 July 1995 Volume 06 : Number 026 Today's Subjects: High altitude help needed First bread machine Help convert rec. Recipe requested Bimini Bread ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: l.farrar@ix.netcom.com (Linda Farrar) Date: Tue, 27 Jun 1995 06:31:17 -0700 Subject: High altitude help needed Could someone please help me. I am new to Colorado and need help in baking bread in my bread machine to get good results. - --Linda l.farrar@ix.netcom.com ------------------------------ From: David Colker Date: Wed, 28 Jun 1995 05:56:04 -0700 (PDT) Subject: First bread machine Just bought my first bread making machine (I normally make bread by hand weekly during the winter months, but it just heats up the kitchen too much in the summer in L.A.), and I already have my first disaster. Bought an Oster, which makes both 1.5 and 1 lb. loaves. For the first loaf, I used a Krusteaz sourdough bread machine mix just to give it a tryout. The loaf hardly rose - it's supposed to be 1.5 lb, but it's only about 4" high. Still cooling off a bit, but I assume that at this density, it is probably not done inside, or at the very least, probably not a good texture. I'm going to call the company later this morning, but in the meantime, anyone else have an Oster. Maybe I got the wrong machine... (Got it at Price Club and could trade it in for a Hitachi, which is a bit more expensive and did not seem to have a French bread cycle, which the Oster does....) David Colker ------------------------------ From: ba903@freenet.carleton.ca (Julia Gilbert) Date: Fri, 30 Jun 1995 09:55:03 -0400 Subject: Help convert rec. I have a great rec. for chocolate Zucchini bread and wondered if anyone could convert it for my 1lb bread maker? Here it is and thanks in advance! 3/4 cup margarine 2cup white sugar 3 eggs 2 1/2 cups flour 1/2 cup unsweetened cocoa powder 2 1/2 teasp. baking powder 1 1/2 teasp. baking soda 1 tsp. salt 1 tsp cinnamon 1/2 cup milk 2 tsp vanilla 3 cup zucchini (shredded) 6 oz choc. chips (optional) makes two 9x5 loafs bake for 1 hr at 350 Thanks Julia - -- Disobedience to conscience makes conscience blind. C.S. Lewis ------------------------------ From: Linda Midcap Date: Mon, 26 Jun 1995 13:48:49 EDT Subject: Recipe requested Could someone post the recipe for Honey French Bread from Donna German's first bread cookbook? It has been recommended to me, and I can only find volumes II thru V at my bookstores. Thanks. Linda Midcap ------------------------------ From: Connie Cunningham Date: Tue, 27 Jun 95 08:36:53 EDT Subject: Bimini Bread Hi, I am hoping someone out there can help me. If you ever tasted warm Bimini Bread then you know why I am looking for a recipe. Can someone help? TIA Connie ------------------------------ End of bread-bakers-digest V6 #26 ********************************* bread-bakers-digest Saturday, 8 July 1995 Volume 06 : Number 027 Today's Subjects: French Honey Bread Donna G's, French Honey Bread Fwd: bread-bakers-digest V6 #26 Re: First bread machine First Bread Machine re: Help convert recipe Gluten Free Help Fwd: bread-bakers-digest V6 #26 Re: Help convert rec Failed Bread Problem & Soution Re: First bread machine High-altitude bread machine tips ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: annminer@nauticom.net (Ann Miner) Date: Sat, 1 Jul 1995 22:27:09 -0400 Subject: French Honey Bread This is one of Donna German's best! Try experimenting with one cup of the flour (use 2 cups bread flour, 1 cup whole wheat or 2 cups bread flour and 1 cup spelt flour, etc.) * Exported from MasterCook II * FRENCH HONEY BREAD Recipe By : Donna German Serving Size : 1 Preparation Time :0:00 Categories : Breadmaker Rolls Amount Measure Ingredient -- Preparation Method - -------- ------------ -------------------------------- 1 tablespoon Honey 1 tablespoon Olive oil 3 cups Bread flour 1 1/8 cups Water 1 teaspoon Salt 1 teaspoon Sugar 2 1/4 teaspoons Yeast Add the ingredients according to your B/M's instructions. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - ------------------------------ From: "Rob Ryerson" Date: Thu, 6 Jul 1995 06:22:16 PST Subject: Donna G's, French Honey Bread Here's the requested recipe. Note I haven't made it, just entered it into Micro Cookbook for formatting and nutritional information. I may try it, but will have to choose a substitute for the oil. I guessed at a number of servings. Enjoy, Rob French Honey Bread 10 Servings Wonderful, slightly sweet French bread with a light, crispy crust. 3/4 cup water 2 teaspoons honey 2 teaspoons olive oil 2/3 teaspoon salt 2/3 teaspoon sugar 2 cups bread flour 1 1/2 teaspoons yeast Add all ingredients to bread machine pan, in order suggested by your manufacture. Select appropriate cycle, and start. Amount Per Serving Calories 112 Calories from Fat 13 Percent Total Calories From: Fat 12% Protein 12% Carb. 76% Nutrient Amount per % Daily Serving Value Total Fat 1 g 2% Saturated Fat 0 g 1% Cholesterol 0 mg 0% Sodium 156 mg 6% Total Carbohydrate 21 g 7% Dietary Fiber 0 g 0% Protein 3 g Vitamin A 0% Vitamin C 0% Iron 7% ------------------------------ From: Mike Strock Date: Fri, 07 Jul 95 19:48:30 -0500 Subject: Fwd: bread-bakers-digest V6 #26 DC>Just bought my first bread making machine (I normally make bread by hand weekly during the winter months, but it just heats up the kitchen too DC>much in the summer in L.A.), and I already have my first disaster. DC>Bought an Oster, which makes both 1.5 and 1 lb. loaves. For the first loaf, I used a Krusteaz sourdough bread machine mix just to give it a DC>tryout. The loaf hardly rose - it's supposed to be 1.5 lb, but it's only about 4" high. Still cooling off a bit, but I assume that at this density, it is DC>probably not done inside, or at the very least, probably not a good texture. DC>I'm going to call the company later this morning, but in the meantime, anyone else have an Oster. Maybe I got the wrong machine... David, I have the same Oster machine that you have (I think, I got it at Costco) and occasionally have the same problem you did. I THINK that it has to do with the temperature of the water that you added to the bread mix and the yeast. I've found that keeping the water temp between 70 and 80 degrees Farenheit is best (middle range is best, of course)...I've had problems such as this when trying to 'wing it' without first checking the temp of the water added. Hope that helps! Mike Strock mstrock@eskimo.com ------------------------------ From: David Colker Date: Thu, 6 Jul 1995 06:00:16 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: First bread machine On Sun, 2 Jul 1995 Sandal@aol.com wrote: > Don't give up on your machine. We've all had hockey pucks now and then. > Sometimes it's just the weather. Try again, maybe from a basic recipe from > your owner's manual. Or try one of these. > > Sandi F. in Fayetteville, Arkansas > Thanks for your advice and encouragement! I have to indeed get in there and experiment. So far, I've made about four loafs, and even those that rose well were dissappointing - texture was spongy and the taste was uninteresting. This weekend I'm going to try a couple of different recipes from the machine's booklet. David Colker ------------------------------ From: ah683@freenet.Buffalo.EDU (Rachel M. Gonsior) Date: Mon, 3 Jul 1995 13:55:06 -0400 Subject: First Bread Machine David Colker mentioned his problem with a Krusteaz mix not rising in his new Oster bread machine. I have been using my Oster for some time now and have never had a bad loaf. I haven't tried any of the Krusteaz mixes. I used the three mixes (no identifiable brand name on them) which came with the machine and they all turned out very well. Since then, I've made all loaves "from scratch" with no problems. Perhaps the Krusteaz mix was laying around in the store too long and the yeast was no longer very good? - -- ------------------------------ From: amy@best.com (Amy Marie Kurtzman) Date: Fri, 7 Jul 1995 23:05:22 -0800 Subject: re: Help convert recipe In digest #26, Julia Gilbert writes: > From: ba903@freenet.carleton.ca (Julia Gilbert) > Date: Fri, 30 Jun 1995 09:55:03 -0400 > Subject: Help convert rec. > > I have a great rec. for chocolate Zucchini bread and wondered if anyone > could convert it for my 1lb bread maker? Here it is and thanks in advance! > > 3/4 cup margarine > 2cup white sugar > 3 eggs > 2 1/2 cups flour > 1/2 cup unsweetened cocoa powder > 2 1/2 teasp. baking powder > 1 1/2 teasp. baking soda > 1 tsp. salt > 1 tsp cinnamon > 1/2 cup milk 2 tsp vanilla > 3 cup zucchini (shredded) > 6 oz choc. chips (optional) > makes two 9x5 loafs bake for 1 hr at 350 I am afraid that you are out of luck with this recipe unless you own one of the Zojirushi machines that have a cake baking cycle. Most bread machines are made for preparing yeast breads only. ------------------------------ From: phyllis.johnpoll@ncsl.org (Phyllis Johnpoll) Date: Thu, 6 Jul 1995 13:18:47 GMT Subject: Gluten Free Help more ways than one, since the person I was making it for is not only unable to tolerate gluten, he can't have any soy, corn, or dairy products. So we had to REALLY play with the recipe. The result was stupendous: He sat and munched his way through a loaf of bread with a grin the size of Milwaukee on his face. (No, we're not in Wisconsin, but it's about the right size city nonetheless...) I tasted it and it wasn't bad. Dense, but okay. He says he'll buy a bread machine if we can prove to him that it'll make lots of different kinds of breads. Does anyone have a favourite gluten-free recipe to share with me? The one I made was Mock Rye, and we were able to handle the required substitutions (mostly for the non-fat dry milk) ourselves, so you don't need to play with your own recipes. My friend and I thank you in advance. *BB* ptj ------------------------------ From: haws@IX.NETCOM.COM (William Haws ) Date: Sat, 1 Jul 1995 21:11:45 -0700 Subject: Fwd: bread-bakers-digest V6 #26 > >Could someone post the recipe for Honey French Bread from Donna >German's first bread cookbook? It has been recommended to me, >and I can only find volumes II thru V at my bookstores. Thanks. > >Linda Midcap Here is Donna German's recipe for French Honey Bread: Small Medium Large water 1/2 cup+ 1 tbs. 3/4 cup 1-1/8 cup honey 1-1/2 tsp. 2 tsp. 1 tbs. olive oil 1-1/2 tsp. 2 tsp. 1 tbs. salt 1/2 tsp. 2/3 tsp. 1 tsp. sugar 1/2 tsp. 2/3 tsp. 1 tsp. bread flour 1-1/2 cups 2 cups 3 cups yeast 1 tsp. 1-1/2 tsp. 2-1/2 tsp. Bill ------------------------------ From: Sandal@aol.com Date: Sun, 2 Jul 1995 16:15:23 -0400 Subject: Re: Help convert rec ba903@freenet.carleton.ca (Julia Gilbert) writes: >I have a great rec. for chocolate Zucchini bread and wondered if anyone >could convert it for my 1lb bread maker? Here it is and thanks in advance! Bad news, I'm afraid. This recipe is for a batter bread (note the use of baking powder and soda and the lack of instructions for kneading and rising). Most bread machines are designed only for yeast breads. A few, such as the Zoji S15 and one of the Panasonics, have a "cake" or "quick bread" (not to be confused with "quick baking") mode that just mixes and bakes without kneading and rising. If your machine has such a mode, just try cutting the recipe (which makes 2 loaves) in half. I suppose this could be converted to a yeast bread, but the wet-to-dry proportions are way off, and I'm afraid by the time we got them under control the bread may no longer be recognizable. I'll leave that challenge for someone else. Sorry. Sandi F. in Fayetteville, Arkansas sandal@aol.com ------------------------------ From: Joel.Ehrlich@salata.com (Joel Ehrlich) Date: 02 Jul 95 11:56:00 -0800 Subject: Failed Bread Problem & Soution owner-bread-bakers@best.com wrote about bread-bakers-digest V6 #26 to All on 01 Jul 95 03:02:21 saying... Responding to: David Colker DC> Just bought my first bread making machine (I normally make bread by DC> hand weekly during the winter months, but it just heats up the kitchen DC> too much in the summer in L.A.), and I already have my first disaster. DC> Bought an Oster, which makes both 1.5 and 1 lb. loaves. For the first DC> loaf, I used a Krusteaz sourdough bread machine mix just to give it a DC> tryout. The loaf hardly rose - it's supposed to be 1.5 lb, but it's DC> only about 4" high. Still cooling off a bit, but I assume that at this DC> density, it is probably not done inside, or at the very least, DC> probably not a good texture. You have just described a classic case of liquid imbalance - not enough liquid for the amount of flour. These machines are not completely automatic. There is one part of the bread making process which cannot be automated, the flour to liquid balance. Since you have made bread by hand, you know what the dough should look like and feel like. Place the ingredients in the pan, start the machine and let it run for a few (2-3) minutes. Open the machine (it's O.K., it won't hurt anything). Check the dough consistency and adjust by adding more liquid or flour, as needed. Let the machine run for a minute or so after each addition. Once the dough is right, close the cover and let the machine do its own thing. Joel ... SYSTEM ERROR. Press F13 to continue. ------------------------------ From: Sandal@aol.com Date: Sun, 2 Jul 1995 16:15:20 -0400 Subject: Re: First bread machine David Colker writes: >Just bought my first bread making machine (I normally make bread by hand >weekly during the winter months, but it just heats up the kitchen too >much in the summer in L.A.), and I already have my first disaster. >Bought an Oster, which makes both 1.5 and 1 lb. loaves. For the first >loaf, I used a Krusteaz sourdough bread machine mix just to give it a >tryout. The loaf hardly rose - it's supposed to be 1.5 lb, but it's only >about 4" high. Still cooling off a bit, but I assume that at this >density, it is probably not done inside, or at the very least, probably >not a good texture. It sounds like it just didn't rise enough. Well, let's start with the obvious. Did you remember to add the yeast? It comes in a separate packet. What about your water temperature? If it was too hot, it could kill the yeast. If it was too cool, the yeast wouldn't activate. Of course, if you're used to making bread by hand, you probably already know about that. Did you use the timer? If so, did you remember to keep the yeast away from the water so that it wouldn't activate too soon? Did you use a quick mode?--they don't rise as much. Since it was a mix, I'll assume that the ingredients were all in their proper proportions. But how old was it? Could it be that it had sat on the shelf too long before you got it? The yeast may be too old. I've had pretty good luck with Krusteaz mixes. Don't give up on your machine. We've all had hockey pucks now and then. Sometimes it's just the weather. Try again, maybe from a basic recipe from your owner's manual. Or try one of these. Sandi F. in Fayetteville, Arkansas ========================= Alice's 7 Grain Bread (for 1 1/2 lb loaf) 1 1/2 c Wheat flour 1 1/2 c Bread flour 1/3 c Seven grain mix 2 T Honey 1 1/2 t Salt 1 3/8 c Water 2 T Canola Oil 1 1/2 t Yeast Bake on RapidBake/Whole Wheat or on Basic/Whole Wheat. >From the Files of Alice in Houston ========================= Dede's Buttermilk Bread 1 lb loaf 1 1/2 lb loaf yeast 1/2 T 2t bread flour 2 c 3 c salt 1 t 1 1/2 t margarine 1 T 1 T honey 2 T 3 T buttermilk* 7/8 c 1 1/8 c Use light crust setting. If desired, use buttermilk powder and water. from Rehberg & Conway, Bread Machine Magic ------------------------------ From: "Ron Olsen" Date: Wed, 5 Jul 1995 16:22:06 -0600 Subject: High-altitude bread machine tips >Could someone please help me. I am new to Colorado and need help in >baking bread in my bread machine to get good results. >- --Linda >l.farrar@ix.netcom.com I live in Denver, and was given a Trillium Breadman Plus for Christmas. I have had great success with it. These tips might help you: 1. Always scoop out the flour you're measuring. Otherwise you'll wind up with way too much flour. 2. If you store your flour in the freezer as I do (keeps bugs out of it), bring it to room temperature before putting it into the bread machine's pan. A minute or so in the microwave does fine. Don't warm the yeast, though. 3. I ALWAYS use vital gluten: A tablespoon and a half for all-bread-flour recipes; at least two and often four with whole grains and other burly mixtures. This is for a large (2-lb) loaf. Be sure you use the gluten when dealing with wheat germ, which actually breaks down the gluten that helps the bread rise. I also usually mix some bread flour (25% to 50%) into whole-grain recipes to prevent bricks. 4. Put all the dry ingredients except the yeast into a bowl and stir thoroughly before putting into the bread machine pan. Do all the dry-ingredient hocus pocus. THEN... 5. Heat liquids (I throw them all in a measuring cup together except for eggs) to about 90 degrees F. It's OK if they're quite a bit cooler than you would want for hand-made bread, for some reason. If you heat them in the microwave, stir first (I use a chopstick), THEN check with your finger. The cooler stuff hides in the middle. The stirring allows you to accurately check temperature. 6. Put all the liquids (now at the correct temperature) in the bottom of the bread machine. Dump in all the dry ingredients. Put the yeast in a little hole you dug with your finger in the top of the resulting hill of flour. Hit the "Go" button. 7. When adding fruits and nuts, I usually toss them in in small batches, and usually start that process well before the machine beeps at me to do so. This helps even the distribution of these items. 8. Donna German recommends that you watch the first few minutes of the knead cycle to make sure the bread is behaving itself. That's a good idea: I've sometimes had to add a little water (a tablespoon or two) to make things work. 9. Using the timer has also worked out well for me. I'm not too bashful about putting milk in there at night to have fresh bread in the morning, and sourdough starter produced spectacular results. I also warm the liquid before setting the timer, though I can't swear that it does any good. (I think this machine has a preheat cycle, though it doesn't say so anywhere.) The biggest problem I have with this bread machine is that the bread it makes is so good I inhale it: a two-pound loaf rarely lasts beyond three days, and I live alone! Hope yours goes as well. What I've given you here is all the "magic" I know. Happy loafing! Lynn Fletcher Denver CO ------------------------------ End of bread-bakers-digest V6 #27 ********************************* bread-bakers-digest Sunday, 16 July 1995 Volume 06 : Number 028 Today's Subjects: Mailing Address Change Re: First bread machine re: Help convert recipe Gluten Free Help Conversion 'rules of thumb'? Donna G's, French Honey Bread Fwd: bread-bakers-digest V6 #26 Tips for Newbies Gluten Free Recipes Gluten Free Help ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Reggie.&.Jeff.Dwork Date: Sat, 15 Jul 1995 23:27:09 -0700 Subject: Mailing Address Change Our address is changing. Best.com has moved majordomo to a new machine. Please send subscription requests to . Please send posts for the list to . The old address will continue to work for a bit longer but please change as soon as you can. We are working on getting the archive functioning. Hope to have it ready next week. Thanks, Reggie and Jeff ------------------------------ From: David Colker Date: Thu, 6 Jul 1995 06:00:16 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: First bread machine On Sun, 2 Jul 1995 Sandal@aol.com wrote: > Don't give up on your machine. We've all had hockey pucks now and then. > Sometimes it's just the weather. Try again, maybe from a basic recipe from > your owner's manual. Or try one of these. > > Sandi F. in Fayetteville, Arkansas > Thanks for your advice and encouragement! I have to indeed get in there and experiment. So far, I've made about four loafs, and even those that rose well were dissappointing - texture was spongy and the taste was uninteresting. This weekend I'm going to try a couple of different recipes from the machine's booklet. David Colker ------------------------------ From: amy@best.com (Amy Marie Kurtzman) Date: Fri, 7 Jul 1995 23:05:22 -0800 Subject: re: Help convert recipe In digest #26, Julia Gilbert writes: > From: ba903@freenet.carleton.ca (Julia Gilbert) > Date: Fri, 30 Jun 1995 09:55:03 -0400 > Subject: Help convert rec. > > I have a great rec. for chocolate Zucchini bread and wondered if anyone > could convert it for my 1lb bread maker? Here it is and thanks in advance! > > 3/4 cup margarine > 2cup white sugar > 3 eggs > 2 1/2 cups flour > 1/2 cup unsweetened cocoa powder > 2 1/2 teasp. baking powder > 1 1/2 teasp. baking soda > 1 tsp. salt > 1 tsp cinnamon > 1/2 cup milk 2 tsp vanilla > 3 cup zucchini (shredded) > 6 oz choc. chips (optional) > makes two 9x5 loafs bake for 1 hr at 350 I am afraid that you are out of luck with this recipe unless you own one of the Zojirushi machines that have a cake baking cycle. Most bread machines are made for preparing yeast breads only. ------------------------------ From: phyllis.johnpoll@ncsl.org (Phyllis Johnpoll) Date: Thu, 6 Jul 1995 13:18:47 GMT Subject: Gluten Free Help more ways than one, since the person I was making it for is not only unable to tolerate gluten, he can't have any soy, corn, or dairy products. So we had to REALLY play with the recipe. The result was stupendous: He sat and munched his way through a loaf of bread with a grin the size of Milwaukee on his face. (No, we're not in Wisconsin, but it's about the right size city nonetheless...) I tasted it and it wasn't bad. Dense, but okay. He says he'll buy a bread machine if we can prove to him that it'll make lots of different kinds of breads. Does anyone have a favourite gluten-free recipe to share with me? The one I made was Mock Rye, and we were able to handle the required substitutions (mostly for the non-fat dry milk) ourselves, so you don't need to play with your own recipes. My friend and I thank you in advance. *BB* ptj ------------------------------ From: s-sehlhorst@ds.mc.ti.com (Scott Sehlhorst) Date: Tue, 11 Jul 95 09:00:43 -0400 Subject: Conversion 'rules of thumb'? As an introduction, I've been lurking for a couple digests, I'm developing a gourmet repertoire by attrition, and I started baking breads and biscuits about 6 months ago. I have to do it the old fashioned way. Most of the traffic here seems to be machine based. Am I wasting time and bandwidth here?- I don't think so, you folks seem to have a lot of expertice with bread! Are there any rules of thumb for converting bread machine recipes for by hand bread making? I know it's really silly, since bread machine recipes started as conversions of hand made recipes, but now there are lots of bread machine developed recipes, that I would like to try and make by hand. The only thing that cought my eye was liquid temps, as I would try and convert 80-90F temps to 110-120F temps before making anything. Is there a canonical list, or an archive site, or a good book for conversions? Scott "and where can I find gluten?" Sehlhorst ------------------------------ From: "Rob Ryerson" Date: Thu, 6 Jul 1995 06:22:16 PST Subject: Donna G's, French Honey Bread Here's the requested recipe. Note I haven't made it, just entered it into Micro Cookbook for formatting and nutritional information. I may try it, but will have to choose a substitute for the oil. I guessed at a number of servings. Enjoy, Rob French Honey Bread 10 Servings Wonderful, slightly sweet French bread with a light, crispy crust. 3/4 cup water 2 teaspoons honey 2 teaspoons olive oil 2/3 teaspoon salt 2/3 teaspoon sugar 2 cups bread flour 1 1/2 teaspoons yeast Add all ingredients to bread machine pan, in order suggested by your manufacture. Select appropriate cycle, and start. Amount Per Serving Calories 112 Calories from Fat 13 Percent Total Calories From: Fat 12% Protein 12% Carb. 76% Nutrient Amount per % Daily Serving Value Total Fat 1 g 2% Saturated Fat 0 g 1% Cholesterol 0 mg 0% Sodium 156 mg 6% Total Carbohydrate 21 g 7% Dietary Fiber 0 g 0% Protein 3 g Vitamin A 0% Vitamin C 0% Iron 7% ------------------------------ From: Mike Strock Date: Fri, 07 Jul 95 19:48:30 -0500 Subject: Fwd: bread-bakers-digest V6 #26 DC>Just bought my first bread making machine (I normally make bread by hand weekly during the winter months, but it just heats up the kitchen too DC>much in the summer in L.A.), and I already have my first disaster. DC>Bought an Oster, which makes both 1.5 and 1 lb. loaves. For the first loaf, I used a Krusteaz sourdough bread machine mix just to give it a DC>tryout. The loaf hardly rose - it's supposed to be 1.5 lb, but it's only about 4" high. Still cooling off a bit, but I assume that at this density, it is DC>probably not done inside, or at the very least, probably not a good texture. DC>I'm going to call the company later this morning, but in the meantime, anyone else have an Oster. Maybe I got the wrong machine... David, I have the same Oster machine that you have (I think, I got it at Costco) and occasionally have the same problem you did. I THINK that it has to do with the temperature of the water that you added to the bread mix and the yeast. I've found that keeping the water temp between 70 and 80 degrees Farenheit is best (middle range is best, of course)...I've had problems such as this when trying to 'wing it' without first checking the temp of the water added. Hope that helps! Mike Strock mstrock@eskimo.com ------------------------------ From: gunterman@ccmailpc.ctron.com Date: Tue, 11 Jul 95 09:06:27 EST Subject: Tips for Newbies I am by no means an EXPERT on Bread baking but after working 4 Years as a professional Cook/Demi-Chef I have learned a few things along the way. Now that I have "retired" to the wonderful world of being a "Techno_Geek", I have plenty of time to play w/ my DAK(R2D2) Bread Machine. 1) Yeast: The single most important factor in bread making. For those people that only casually make bread, By hand or in their machine: I would recommend buying packets of yeast as needed. MAKE SURE YOU CHECK THE DATE ON THE PACKAGE! For people that bake at least 1 Loaf a week or more: Buy a small Jar of yeast. You can usually find them in the cooler right next to the package yeast. It seems like a lot, I know, but it goes FAST, TRUST ME! I have no explanation for this one but I thought it might be of interest: I found 1/2 a jar in the back of my fridge that was OVER a year old and it still performed just fine. Go figure! 2) Rising: For recipes that just wont rise correctly try increasing the liquid amount _SLIGHTLY_ and adding a tablespoon of Whole Wheat Gluten(available at gourmet and Health food stores. 3) Falling Loaves(loaves that sink during cooling): Add an egg to the ingredients! The egg will help the loaf "setup" and prevent it from falling during cooling. 4) Ambient Temperature(The temperature of the room outside the machine) This can be the biggest problem for some people and they wont even know it! I have recipes that just will not work at all if the ambient temperature is below 70 Degree. If you have a draft in the winter or a cool summer breeze from an open window...FORGET IT! On my particular machine I simply wrap some aluminum foil around the top of it(blocking the "vents") to prevent (or at least slow down) the offending air currents. it helps but is not a sure fire cure. Hope this helps someone out there. L8r John A. Gunterman Macintosh Specialist Technical Support Group Cabletron Systems Inc. gunterman@ctron.com gunterman@eworld.com ______________________________________________ The opinions expressed in this message are solely mine. If they coincide w/ ctron's opinion's it is purely coincidental. ______________________________________________ ------------------------------ From: z@fybits.com (Z Pegasus) Date: Wed, 12 Jul 1995 12:25:58 Subject: Gluten Free Recipes .#200 p@>From: phyllis.johnpoll@ncsl.org (Phyllis Johnpoll) p@>lots of different kinds of breads. Does anyone have a favourite p@>gluten-free recipe to share with me? The one I made was Mock Rye, and we Here is some info and recipes that I have - hope this helps! Bobbi If you find someone that is gluten intolerant we'd love to have them join the mailing list. It is at . To join, send a message to the listserver with SUB CELIAC yourfirstname yourlastname in the body of the message. MMMMM----- Recipe via Meal-Master (tm) v8.02 Title: Gene's Basic Rice Bread Categories: Breads, Machine, Gluten-free Yield: 6 servings 1 c Fresh gluten-free buttermilk 1/4 c Butter, melted 1 ts Rice vinegar 1 1/2 ts Salt 2 c Brown rice flour 1/3 c Potato starch flour 1/3 c Tapioca flour 1/4 c Sugar 3 1/2 ts Xanthan gum 3 Eggs 1/2 c Water (for Welbilt/DAK and -Zoji Machines, add 2 Tbsp. more -water) 1 1/2 tb Active dry yeast "Gene Hill, who lives in Davis, California, bakes this bread at least twice a week. He recommends trying it as a toasted cheese sandwich. Grill it with thin slices of red onion or bell pepper and cheese." Place the buttermilk, melted butter, rice vinegar, and salt in bread pan. Stir with a rubber spatula. In a large bowl, combine all the dry ingredients except the yeast. Mix well with a whisk. In a separate bowl, combine the eggs and water; beat lightly. Place 1/2 of the dry ingredients in the bread pan. Add the egg mixture. Add the remainder of the dry ingredients; sprinkle the yeast on top. Select Light Crust setting and press Start. Observe the dough frequently during the kneading cycles. If it does not appear to be mixing well, use a rubber spatula to assist it occasionally. After the baking cycle ends, remove bread from pan, place on wire rack, and allow to cool 1 hour before slicing. Variations: You can substitute olive oil for the butter. Replace 1/4 to 1/2 cup of the rice flour with another gluten-free flour, such as yellow or blue corn flour, polenta meal, or soy flour. You can add at least 1/4 cup grated cheddar cheese for a new flavor. Saute some onions in the melted butter, allow them to cool, then add them and your favorite herbs to create an onion/herb bread. Optional bake cycle: Sweet bread, Rapid bake. From: "Bread Machine Magic Book of Helpful Hints" by Linda Rehberg and Lois Conway Posted by: Debbie Carlson - Cooking MMMMM MMMMM----- Recipe via Meal-Master (tm) v8.02 Title: Gf Bob's Cheddar Cheese Bread Categories: Allergy, Breads, Machine, Gluten-free Yield: 14 servings 2 3/4 ts Active dry yeast 1 c Brown rice flour 2 c White rice flour 3 1/2 ts Xanthan gum 2 tb Sugar 1 ts Salt 1 1/2 c Grate x-sharp Cheddar cheese 1/4 c Nonfat dry milk powder 2 tb Butter or margarine, soft 2 lg Eggs, well beaten 1 3/4 c Warm water "This rich bread is flecked with grated cheese. If you're daring, try adding 2 or 3 tablespoons of diced jalapeno peppers to it. It's also good toasted. We have Bob and Melody Gabriel to thank for sharing this gluten-free recipe." Place all ingredients, except warm water, in bread pan, select Light Crust setting, and press Start. While the machine is kneading, gradually pour in the water. If the dough does not mix well, use a rubber spatula to assist it occasionally. After the baking cycle ends, remove bread from pan, place on wire rack, and allow to cool 1 hour before slicing. 1 1/2 pound loaf. Optional bake cycles: Sweet Bread, Rapid Bake. (Nutrition info. not stated.) Source: The Bread Machine Magic Book of Helpful Hints by Linda Rehberg & Lois Conway. From: Elizabeth Rodier ~-- MMMMM MMMMM----- Recipe via Meal-Master (tm) v8.02 Title: Gf Melody's Brown and White Bread Categories: Allergy, Breads, Machine, Gluten-free Yield: 14 servings 2 1/4 ts Active dry yeast (1 packet) 1 c Brown rice flour 2 c White rice flour 3 1/2 ts Xanthan gum 1/4 c + 2 tsp sugar 1 1/2 ts Salt 1 1/3 c Nonfat dry milk powder 1/4 c Butter or margarine, melted 2 lg Eggs, well beaten 1 3/4 c Warm water Quantities given for 1 1/2 pound loaf. Book also has 1 pound quantities. Melody Gabriel from Vero Beach, Florida, shared this basic, easy-to-make recipe and when others tried it, the consensus was "Wonderful." 1. Place all ingredients, except the warm water, in bread pan and press start. While the machine is kneading, gradually pour in the water. If the dough does not mix well, use a rubber spatula to assist it occasionally. 2. After the baking cycle ends, remove bread from pan, place on wire rack, and allow to cool 1 hour before slicing. Crust: Medium Optional Bake Cycles: Sweet Bread, Rapid Bake Source: The Bread Machine Magic Book of Helpful Hints by Linda Rehberg and Lois Conway 1993 ISBN 0-312-09759-X Shared but not tested by Elizabeth Rodier, Dec 93 MMMMM MMMMM----- Recipe via Meal-Master (tm) v8.02 Title: Gf Gene's Basic Rice Bread Categories: Allergy, Breads, Machine, Gluten-free Yield: 14 servings 1 c Fresh gluten-free buttermilk 1/4 c Butter, melted 1 ts Rice vinegar 1 1/2 ts Salt 2 c Brown rice flour 1/3 c Potato starch flour 1/3 c Tapioca flour 1/4 c Sugar 3 1/2 ts Xanthan gum 3 Eggs 1/2 c Water (Welbilt/DAK & Z +2 Tb 1 1/2 tb Active dry yeast Gene Hill, who lives in Davis, California, bakes this bread at least twice a week. He recommends trying it as a toasted cheese sandwich. Grill it with thin slices of red onion or bell pepper and cheese. 1. Place the buttermilk, melted butter, rice vinegar, and salt in bread pan. Stir with a rubber spatula. 2. In a large bowl, combine all the dry ingredients except the yeast. Mix well with a whisk. 3. In a separate bowl, combine the eggs and water; beat lightly. 4. Place 1/2 of the dry ingredients in the bread pan. Add the egg mixture. Add the remainder of the dry ingredients; sprinkle the yeast on top. Select Light Crust setting and press Start. 5. Observe the dough frequently during the kneading cycles. If it does not appear to be mixing well, use a rubber spatula to assist it occasionally. 6. After the baking cycle ends, remove bread from pan, place on wire rack, and allow to cool 1 hour before slicing. VARIATIONS * You can substitute olive oil for the butter. * Replace 1/4 to 1/2 cup of the rice flour with another gluten-free flour, such as yellow or blue corn flour, polenta meal, or soy flour. * You can add at least 1/4 cup grated cheddar cheese for a new flavor. * Saute some onions in the melted butter, allow them to cool, then add them and your favorite herbs to create an onion/herb bread. Crust: Light Optional Bake Cycle: Sweet Bread, Rapid Bake Source: The Bread Machine Magic Book of Helpful Hints by Linda Rehberg and Lois Conway 1993 ISBN 0-312-09759-X Shared but not tested by Elizabeth Rodier, Dec 93 MMMMM ------------------------------ From: phyllis.johnpoll@ncsl.org (Phyllis Johnpoll) Date: Thu, 6 Jul 1995 13:18:47 GMT Subject: Gluten Free Help [Comment from your listowners: We are re-posting this because the first line got lost. The first line of your message should start in column one. If you leave a space majordomo will eat the line and possibly more. After the first line you can do what you want. Not meaning to pick on you Phyllis but you are the example we caught before the digest went out.] I recently made my first gluten-free bread. It was an experiment in more ways than one, since the person I was making it for is not only unable to tolerate gluten, he can't have any soy, corn, or dairy products. So we had to REALLY play with the recipe. The result was stupendous: He sat and munched his way through a loaf of bread with a grin the size of Milwaukee on his face. (No, we're not in Wisconsin, but it's about the right size city nonetheless...) I tasted it and it wasn't bad. Dense, but okay. He says he'll buy a bread machine if we can prove to him that it'll make lots of different kinds of breads. Does anyone have a favourite gluten-free recipe to share with me? The one I made was Mock Rye, and we were able to handle the required substitutions (mostly for the non-fat dry milk) ourselves, so you don't need to play with your own recipes. My friend and I thank you in advance. *BB* ptj ------------------------------ End of bread-bakers-digest V6 #28 ********************************* bread-bakers-digest Sunday, 23 July 1995 Volume 06 : Number 029 Today's Subjects: mail Rising problems NEW SUBSCRIBER Re: bread-bakers-digest V6 #28 Kneading test Bread Baker Recall Bread Machine Covers & Cloth Gift Bags 4 Bread my first sourdough success in a machine! Re: White Breads bread-bakers-digest V6 #28 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: ATMCDANIEL@ALPHA.NLU.EDU Date: Fri, 21 Jul 1995 11:28:17 -0500 (CDT) Subject: mail Yesterday, I was out of bread flour and used some hot roll mix I had... don't ever try that...it was a disaster!!! Top caved in and when you squeezed it it was like a sponge!! But my birds in the back yard loved it! (they have to eat too!) ------------------------------ From: pasquale@lanl.gov (Gina Pasquale) Date: Mon, 17 Jul 1995 08:20:13 -0600 Subject: Rising problems Hello, I have a Chefmate (Seiko) machine. I've noticed that my bread rises very well during the first and second rise cycles. On the last (third) cycle, the bread doesn't rise as well and I end up with a smaller, denser loaf, that sometimes seems to cave in. Does anyone have any suggestions for me. (Also, I live at 6600' in elevation.) Thanks in advance, Gina ------------------------------ From: Donna33333@aol.com Date: Tue, 11 Jul 1995 14:42:26 -0400 Subject: NEW SUBSCRIBER I would like to know (ASAP) whether 100% whole grain bread made on the automatic whole grain cycles of different brands of bread makers turns out the same. I know the high-end Zojirushi is called "the best" machine, but I am interested in comparing the actual whole grain bread as produced on the automatic cycle, not in the features of the machines. Thank you for your help. ------------------------------ From: "Tracy L. Carter" Date: Mon, 17 Jul 95 08:16:41 LCL Subject: Re: bread-bakers-digest V6 #28 > >Scott "and where can I find gluten?" Sehlhorst > Our Kroger store carries it. For some strange reason they stock it in the section with the "health" foods. Tracy L. Carter, Computer Programmer Technician PA100597@UTKVM1.UTK.EDU Univ. of Tennessee College of Social Work **DISCLAIMER: Any opinions stated are not the opinions of my employer! "A conclusion is simply the place where you got tired of thinking!" ------------------------------ From: Roland Kwee Date: Wed, 19 Jul 1995 07:22:47 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Kneading test Hi, Does anyone have experience with hand kneading and determining with when the kneading is done? In many bread books (e.g., Laurel's Kitchen Bread Book) it says to knead about 10 minutes for a one-loaf dough (about 450 g of whole-wheat flour) after which it should stretch 'paper-thin'. My dough never became 'paper-thin', even after kneading much longer. I thought I followed all instructions of the book. Has anyone using a kneading hook or bread machine noticed this condition of dough that stretches 'paper-thin' ? Please e-mail me directly, as your response may not be included in the moderated digest I subscribed to. Thanks, Roland Kwee ------------------------------ From: Jim Carey Date: Wed, 19 Jul 1995 22:11:10 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Bread Baker Recall The July,1995 Consumer Reports had the following recall notice in it: West Bend Automatic bread and dough makers (all models) Could overheat and catch fire. Products: 425,000 appliances made 6/1/94-4/9/95 and sold for up to $300. Box-shaped breadmakers mix, knead, and bake bread. Products are made of white or black metal with matching plastic lid. Part of lid that contains control panel is labeled, in part: "Automatic Bread & Dough Maker ... West Bend ..." Check 5- or 6-digit manufacture-date stamp (listing month, day6, year) on back of unit. What to do: Call 800-367-0111 for free pickup and repair. Company will extend warranty for 1 yr. and will include 6 free bread mixes with repaired appliance. ------------------------------ From: Ron Fritz Date: Mon, 17 Jul 1995 07:15:39 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Bread Machine Covers & Cloth Gift Bags 4 Bread [Editorial Comment from the listowner:] [We think this kind of announcement is ok.] I don't know if it is proper to provide info on product availability in this mailing list; if not then please delete this message. If it is acceptable, my wife would like me to pass along the fact that she is beginning to supply bread machine covers and also makes a nice cloth bag with a wooden ring for a closure to place a bread loaf into when giving a loaf of bread as a gift. Presently she is selling them on a wholesale basis. Please email me if you are interested or know of any stores in your area that might be interested in carrying these items. My email address is . My wife's business phone is 414-376-9030 and her business is called "Bread & Butter" ------------------------------ From: oviattws@alaska.net (scott oviatt) Date: Mon, 17 Jul 1995 23:16:28 +0900 Subject: my first sourdough success in a machine! Hello everyone, Like John Gunterman(digest#27) I also have a DAK, and just on Sunday I successfully made my first sourdough bread in it! I have made sourdough by hand before and it was successful, but when it came to doing it in machine, I was just a little apprehensive, knowing of how temperamental starters can be! I had just received some starter that came west over the Oregon Trail, so it's pretty special! I will take some down (finished product) to the folks in Oregon next week. Pancakes with fresh blueberries--my mouth is watering already! Someone in the last digest mentioned that not too many people were talking about manually baking; well I'd like to assure him that I love ro knead the dough by hand, but I reserve this for specialty breads, as I use the machine to crank out bread for the family every day--it really is more economical and tastes so much better. Right everyone??!!! Regards to you all and happy baking!! Jill Oviatt oviattws@alaska.net - ------------------------ The man who fears the unknown will someday take fright at his own backside. - --Sinbad from "The Golden Voyage of Sinbad" That's alright....I still got my guitar ------------------------------ From: Cdluria@aol.com Date: Fri, 21 Jul 1995 00:18:12 -0400 Subject: Re: White Breads When we first acquired our breadmaker, we were surprised to find a lack of consistency in repeated productions of the same recipe. Sometimes the bread would come out higher, sometimes denser, and once it hardly rose all. We were pretty careful about our measurements and put the difference down to changes in humidity. But the problem vanished when we started _weighing_ the flour instead of using a measuring cup, (we bought an inexpensive kitchen scale from K-Mart). When we checked the weight of our usual three cups of flour (and repeated the test three or four times), we found that that the results ranged from 12 to 15.5 ozs -- a variation of about 25%! We settled on 13.5 ozs and haven't had a problem since. The other change we made was to use distilled rather than tap water, for the chlorine content of the latter is quite high, at times, and we thought it might be weakening the yeast. While we like Donna German's French Honey Bread, the white bread we make most often is the Breadman's recipe. Fresh out of the machine it makes great sandwiches, and wonderful toast when it's a day old. For a 1 1/2 lb. loaf: 9 ozs (1 cup + 2 Tbl.) Water 2 Tbl. Canola Oil 1 1/2 Tbl. Honey 13.5 ozs (3 cups) All Purpose, Unbleached Flour 3 Tbl. Non-Fat Dry Milk 1 1/2 tsp. Salt 2 tsp. Active Dry Yeast cdluria@aol.com ------------------------------ From: Harper Date: Tue, 18 Jul 1995 01:47:10 -0400 (EDT) Subject: bread-bakers-digest V6 #28 >As an introduction, I've been lurking for a couple digests, I'm >developing a gourmet repertoire by attrition, and I started baking >breads and biscuits about 6 months ago. I have to do it the old >fashioned way. Most of the traffic here seems to be machine based. >Am I wasting time and bandwidth here?- I don't think so, you folks >seem to have a lot of expertice with bread! [snip] I'm delurking to announce that I also don't own a bread machine. I have nothing against them, but I find my current method satisfactory. I don't exactly make bread "by hand," though -- I use a heavy-duty Kitchen Aid mixer to knead the dough, and a microwave oven to raise it. That's right -- a microwave. I never used to be able to make decent bread. It always came out as heavy as a doorstop. Recently, I found a great book in the library called "Bread in Half the Time" by Linda Eckhardt and Diana Butts. It explained how to make bread using a food processor to knead the dough and a microwave set on very low power to raise the dough. I tried it, and IT WORKS. For the first time in my life I'm consistently producing light, edible loaves. One rising takes about 15 minutes, sometimes longer if it's a whole-grain bread. >From start to finish takes two hours at the most. (Incidentally, the book also has a section of bread machine recipes -- mostly ones that involve making dough in the machine, then finishing by traditional methods.) I highly recommend this book. After I returned the library copy, I went out and bought my own. (Insert standard "just a satisfied customer" disclaimer here.) I'm also curious to know if machine recipes can be re-converted for traditional baking. I think it should be possible. The proportions look right, so it's just a matter of getting the time and temperature right. And for that you can use other recipes as a guide. Try 375 F for about 40 minutes for a start. Harper *%*%*%* rcmann@delphi.com "Mostly Harmless" -- Douglas Adams ------------------------------ End of bread-bakers-digest V6 #29 ********************************* bread-bakers-digest Saturday, 29 July 1995 Volume 06 : Number 030 Today's Subjects: Gluten gluten Machine Kneading collapsed loaf RE: Rising Problems Kneading Dough Colonial Bread recipe Where can I get bread bags? Measuring Ingredients Rye bread recipe ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: gunterman@ccmailpc.ctron.com Date: Mon, 24 Jul 95 14:07:44 EST Subject: Gluten >> >>Scott "and where can I find gluten?" Sehlhorst >Our Kroger store carries it. For some strange reason they stock it in the >section with the "health" foods. I usually get mine from the local Health Food store. John "another one w/ a funny middle name from the Chile Heads List" G. gunterman@eworld.com (Play) gunterman@ctron.com (Work) ------------------------------ From: Joel.Ehrlich@salata.com (Joel Ehrlich) Date: 23 Jul 95 10:46:22 -0800 Subject: gluten > >Scott "and where can I find gluten?" Sehlhorst > ow> Our Kroger store carries it. For some strange reason they stock it in ow> the section with the "health" foods. ow> Tracy L. Carter, Computer Programmer Technician Or you can mail order it from King Arthur's Flour. But they don't sell chile peppers, so Scott probably won't buy from them :-). Joel ... Situation Normal. Panic Accordingly. ------------------------------ From: rcox@UH.EDU (RH Cox) Date: Mon, 24 Jul 1995 20:17:04 -0600 Subject: Machine Kneading I got a cuisenart over the weekend and tried to make 100% whole wheat bread with only flour, ice water, yeast and salt. After a few minutes, the kneading blade finnaly formed a ball, and a couple minutes later, it looked kneaded enough. When I checked the dough, it was so hot that finished kneaded it by hand. Ended up with a very unimpressive loaf. I am wondering If I am expecting to much from this machine? Any suggestions will be gratefully welcomed. Ralph Luck! Physics has nothing to do with luck. Physics is fact!....The Doctor ------------------------------ From: Joel.Ehrlich@salata.com (Joel Ehrlich) Date: 23 Jul 95 10:46:10 -0800 Subject: collapsed loaf ow> I have a Chefmate (Seiko) machine. I've noticed that my bread rises ow> very well during the first and second rise cycles. On the last (third) ow> cycle, the bread doesn't rise as well and I end up with a smaller, ow> denser loaf, that sometimes seems to cave in. Does anyone have any ow> suggestions for me. (Also, I live at 6600' in elevation.) ow> Thanks in advance, ow> Gina A collapsed loaf (also called a "Crown Loaf") is almost always a sign of too much liquid. The loaf rises too much and then collapses. Joel ... I am a professional - I won't even try this at home! ------------------------------ From: Brian Hostetler Date: Sun, 23 Jul 1995 11:42:34 -0500 (EST) Subject: RE: Rising Problems Gina, I think your problem is too much moisture. I've read this in a bread book I have laying around in some pile. Anyway, I've had this problem recently in my 3 year-old Hitachi. It happens even when I cut the water level down to 250mls from 270 for a large loaf. I suspect is has to do with the high humidity in Bloomington. However, the fact that my roommates keep a fan pointed into the kitchen (blows air conditioned air in there) might have some influence as well. - -- Brian The Internet: Your old grade school home room. http://silver.ucs.indiana.edu/~brianh/home.html ------------------------------ From: Joel.Ehrlich@salata.com (Joel Ehrlich) Date: 23 Jul 95 10:45:38 -0800 Subject: Kneading Dough ow> Hi, ow> Does anyone have experience with hand kneading and determining ow> with when the kneading is done? In many bread books (e.g., Laurel's ow> Kitchen Bread Book) it says to knead about 10 minutes for a one-loaf ow> dough (about 450 g of whole-wheat flour) after which it should ow> stretch 'paper-thin'. My dough never became 'paper-thin', even ow> after kneading much longer. I thought I followed all instructions ow> of the book. ow> Thanks, Roland Kwee The dough does not stretch paper thin, _you_ can stretch properly kneaded dough to paper thinness. Joel ... Pie R square? NO! Pie R Round! Cornbread R Square! ------------------------------ From: oviattws@alaska.net (scott oviatt) Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 17:07:22 -0800 Subject: Colonial Bread recipe Hello bakers! I wanted to share with you all my favorite bread machine recipe. My DAK makes 1 1/2 lb.loaves, so if yours are smaller.. The description is as follows: An early American favorite with a rich sweet flavor and unique texture. COLONIAL BREAD 1 pkg.yeast 3 1/2 C. bread flour 1/3 C. yellow cornmeal 1 1/2 C. boiling water 1/3 C. molasses 1 t. salt 1 T. butter (use ingredients at room temp.) Place cornmeal into bowl. Carefully pour boiling water into cornmeal, stirring to make sure it is smooth. Let stand to cool for about 30 minutes. Stir in molasses, salt, and butter. Place yeast in pan, bread flour, and then cornmeal mixture. Select "white bread" and push "start" Hope you like it as well as I do! That's alright....I still got my guitar ------------------------------ From: suneeta@tss.com (Suneeta Aggarwal) Date: Mon, 24 Jul 1995 10:24:51 -0700 Subject: Where can I get bread bags? I'm curious as to how others store their bread-machine bread. I've been buying the large (one-gallon size?) ziploc bags but the entire loaf doesn't fit very easily. Thus, I have to slice the bread first and store it in two bags. Not terribly convenient. Surely, there must be a place (mail-order perhaps) that sells plastic bags sized for bread-machine loaves. Anyone know of such a retailer? BTW, I've also tried using produce bags but they often are not strong enough. Thanks, Suneeta suneeta@tss.com - -- **************************************************************** * | * * Suneeta Aggarwal | email: suneeta@tss.com * * Teknekron Software Systems, Inc. | Voice: 415-833-2728 * * 530 Lytton Ave, Suite 301 | FAX: 415-321-3176 * * Palo Alto, CA 94301 | * * | * **************************************************************** ------------------------------ From: sherae@zeta.org.au (Sheri McRae) Date: Tue, 25 Jul 1995 07:49:08 +1000 Subject: Measuring Ingredients Whenever I see a comment about measuring ingredients such as (cdluria@aol.com) made I shout encouragement. "When we first acquired our breadmaker, we were surprised to find a lack of consistency in repeated productions of the same recipe. Sometimes the bread would come out higher, sometimes denser, and once it hardly rose all. We were pretty careful about our measurements and put the difference down to changes in humidity. But the problem vanished when we started _weighing_ the flour instead of using a measuring cup." In Australia we're on the metric system and most dry ingredients are weighed rather than measured. Having used both systems for years I find the weighing process far, far more reliable. It also has some drawbacks - moisture in flour will vary the weight, etc. But I'd love to see more recipes converted to weight rather than volume and perhaps we'd all have more consistent results with our bread. Cheers, Sheri Sheri McRae sherae@zeta.org.au Things are more like they are now than they have ever been. - President Gerald Ford ------------------------------ From: Mads H|jbjerg Toftum Date: Sun, 23 Jul 1995 18:44:20 +0200 (MET DST) Subject: Rye bread recipe Rye Bread I (Sourdough) 0.3 liter water 25 gram yeast 1/2 tsp honey 200 gram rye flour (coarse) Mix and cover with cling film, leave at room temperature 48 hours. II 0.4 liter water 500 gram rye grains (cracked / cut). 200 gram wheat flour Mix with sourdough (I),cover with film and leave at room temperature for 24 hours. III 0.5 - 0.75 liter warm (ca. 32C/90F) water 2 tsp salt 600 gram rye flour (coarse) Add to II and knead until the dough is smooth. Remove 0.15 liter of the dough to act as sourdough next time. Put in a 3 liter tin (Preferably the same shape as a regular toast bread). Let the bread raise for 2 hours at room temperature. Brush with water and make holes with a fork. Bake 90 minutes in a preheated oven. Freezes well. NB! Rye bread is regularly eaten in Denmark for lunch, and is used for open sandwiches, rye bread is rich in fibres and thus much more healthy than regular bread. A roughly similar version is know in Germany as Schwartzbrot. To make Danish open sanwiches, slice the bread thinly and cut each slice in half. Just about anything that could go in a regular sandwich can be used on top. An example could be: butter the slice of bread, put a small leaf of lettuce on, put alternate slices of egg and tomato on (3 or 4 of each), put a little mayo on top and sprinkle with freshly cut chives. Another version could be a full slice of bread with a hamburger on top and fried onions. In a near future I'll be typing up a collection of ideas for open sandwiches. ------------------------------ End of bread-bakers-digest V6 #30 ********************************* bread-bakers-digest Tuesday, 8 August 1995 Volume 06 : Number 031 Today's Subjects: Re: bread-bakers-digest V6 #30 Request for recipe bread bags Re: bread-bakers-digest V6 #30 Jam [none] Majordomo problems bread bags Pointer to rec.food.cooking reorganization CFV bread bags Re: Where can I get bread bags? Questions Regarding Bread Makers Re: Where can I get bread bags? Re: Gluten-free help You Might Be Interested In This ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: karen@brahms.amd.com (Karen Black) Date: Sun, 30 Jul 95 06:50:58 PDT Subject: Re: bread-bakers-digest V6 #30 I find that my bread molds too fast if stored in a plastic bag, so I use a wooden bread box. If it lasts long enough to dry out (2-4 days, depending on the recipe), I use the stale bread for crumbs or feed it to the ducks. Karen Black ------------------------------ From: cat@iadfw.net (Cheryl Taylor) Date: Mon, 31 Jul 1995 08:56:20 -0500 Subject: Request for recipe Could someone out there with an Oster breadmaker please post the recipe for quick "sourdough" bread that comes in that machine's cookbook? It uses yogurt and lemon juice for the sour taste and is really easy. Plus you don't have to plan ahead for starter to ferment. Thanks so much. Cheryl ------------------------------ From: britter@mcs.net (B. Ritter) Date: Sun, 30 Jul 95 23:19 CDT Subject: bread bags Although this sounds like heresy, occasionally I buy a loaf of *very special* bread from an excellent bakery in one of our Chicago-area grocery store chains. I then save the bag to use for the bread I make in my bread machine. True, it has to be a *very special* bread to justify my purchase, but, hey, I'm not the only one who can make mouth-watering bread! :-) A friend has suggested that I could probably buy a small quantity of loaf bags from that same bakery. I haven't done it, but I expect it'd be worth trying. On second thought, I really prefer my way of acquiring bags because it allows me to sample different and unusual breads that give me ideas for variations in my bread machinbe recipes. Betty Ritter B. Ritter britter@mcs.net ------------------------------ From: gourmet@mail.utexas.edu Date: Sun, 30 Jul 1995 22:13:38 -0400 Subject: Re: bread-bakers-digest V6 #30 Hi, Reggie -- I'm forwarding this through you, since I'm not sure how to handle this. I do sell Tupperware, so I can't say I don't, but I am making this recommendation because I really believe that this is a good product (I got my own as soon as it came out). Also, since Suneeta is in California, I would recommend she find a local Tupperware Consultant, so I wouldn't make any money off of this. I know that advertising is frowned on, but this seems to fall into a grey area, so I wanted to run this by you to get your opinion and let you decide whether it should appear. Suneeta Aggarwal said: >I'm curious as to how others store their bread-machine bread. >I've been buying the large (one-gallon size?) ziploc bags but >the entire loaf doesn't fit very easily. Thus, I have to slice >the bread first and store it in two bags. Not terribly convenient. >Surely, there must be a place (mail-order perhaps) that sells >plastic bags sized for bread-machine loaves. Anyone know of such >a retailer? Hi Suneeta, I recently purchased a Bread Baker's Delight from Tupperware. It is a square container with an easy open seal that is just the right size for a 1 1/2-lb loaf of bread machine bread. I really love it and definitely recommend it. The other recommendation (what we used to do, was store it on a covered cake plate. This sometimes caused problems, though, if the loaf was too tall (generally not too often, since we "ate it down" enough to put on the plate). Cindy ------------------------------ From: mary_white@sunshine.net (Mary White) Date: Fri, 4 Aug 95 16:20 PDT Subject: Jam My Hitachi bread machine will make jam, but the recipes that came with it are all by weight and for fruits I don't have around. Right now, what I have around is blackberries. Can anyone give me a good BLACKBERRY JAM recipe that they've tested in a bread machine? Quick, before they're all gone! Thanks, Mary ------------------------------ From: pasquale@lanl.gov (Gina Pasquale) Date: Tue, 1 Aug 1995 07:23:54 -0600 Subject: [none] >Surely, there must be a place (mail-order perhaps) that sells plastic bags sized for bread-machine loaves. Anyone know of such a retailer? Thanks, Suneeta suneeta@tss.com Suneeta, Try the King Arthur Flour Baker's Catalog at (800) 827-6836. They have a great selection of baking supplies. I use their bread bags and they are plenty big enough. Gina ------------------------------ From: reggie@reggie.com (Reggie Dwork) Date: Mon, 07 Aug 1995 23:45:23 -0700 Subject: Majordomo problems Majordomo was down over the weekend Aug 5th until sometime Monday Aug 7. If you sent anything to bread-bakers and it bounced back to you, please send it again. That's also why this digest is late. Thanks, Jeff & Reggie - -- Reggie & Jeff Dwork Owners, eat-lf mailing list and bread-bakers mailing list eat-lf-admin@reggie.com bread-bakers-admin@reggie.com ------------------------------ From: bhodgema@students.wisc.edu (Bryce Hodgeman) Date: Mon, 31 Jul 1995 13:26:56 -0500 Subject: bread bags Instead of bread bags, we store our bread in a Tupperware container. It holds just one loaf of bread. It is made especially for bread machine bread. It is clear so that you can see when you need to make more bread! It seals tightly & has an "ultra-fresh" grid on the bottom to keep the bottom fresh. I think I paid about $15 for it. Bread bags would still be necessary to freeze bread. We just make one loaf at a time. It is what I was looking for. Julie ------------------------------ From: Stephanie da Silva Date: Fri, 4 Aug 1995 11:35:12 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Pointer to rec.food.cooking reorganization CFV There is currently an active vote being taken for these newsgroups proposed to be created in the rec.food hierarchy: rec.food.spicy+hot rec.food.bread rec.food.cooking.equipment rec.food.cooking.marketplace rec.food.cooking.books+tv rec.food.cooking.modified-diet rec.food.cooking.misc If you wish to vote, you may obtain a ballot from either the votetaker Jim Davis or from the newsgroup news.announce.newgroups. ------------------------------ From: Ellen Stier Date: Mon, 31 Jul 1995 10:19:13 -0700 (PDT) Subject: bread bags Suneeta Aggarwal asked about bread bags. I replied in rec.food.cooking also, but for the list, I thought I'd reply again. I bought a box of bakery bags at the local "restaurant" store (Smart & Final Iris -- it's a chain). There were 500 for less than 10.00. Enough to last me for longer than I'll remember what I paid, anyway. They are very thick and plenty roomy for a 1.5 pound, well-risen loaf. I give away a lot of bread and I just tie these clear bags off with a pretty ribbon. Ellen ------------------------------ From: Ruth C Perry Date: Tue, 01 Aug 1995 16:02:19 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: Where can I get bread bags? The King Arthur Flour Baker's Catalogue offers a variety of bread bags. [I do not work for them; have no relatives working for them; have no financial interest in them...] They have heavy plastic bags that come in four different sizes and sold in packs of 100. They also have a couple of more "permanent" type bread holder: a machine washable cotton twill bread bag, and an expandable, vented hard plastic box called Bread Keeper. When I called them, they had recommended the Bread Keeper. It works just fine for me. I will probably buy some of the plastic bags as well, since I need something to put the bread in when I give it as a gift. The Baker's Catalogue King Arthur Flour P.O.Box 876 Norwich, Vermont 05055-0876 (800)827-6836 ------------------------------ From: Aaron M Frankel Date: Mon, 31 Jul 1995 15:39:15 -0400 Subject: Questions Regarding Bread Makers Hi, I have been dieting somewhat sucessfully now for the summer (down to 178 from 220 while able to put on some more muscle mass) and am trying to come to a gradual soft landing into more and more "normal type" food. I have always been a big bread fan - but during my diet avoided it (except for lite sliced sandwich bread) I would love make my own bread if it was reasonably economical and healthy. So a few questions. 1) Healthy home made bread: does it exist? If so how does it taste - can one get reasonably good bread using egg beaters, skim milk, etc. 2) Home made vs. commercial - how does homemade bread stack up economicaly and healthwise vs. commercial bread? 3) What kind of bread maker should I get? Any features that I "must have" and pitfalls to avoid - any specific model recomendations or warnings? Damark has a sale on a factory serviced breadmaker ($80) - Is this a good price to pay. Thanks for your help. ------------------------------ From: "Debi Heiser" Date: Tue, 1 Aug 1995 03:38:19 +0000 Subject: Re: Where can I get bread bags? > From: suneeta@tss.com (Suneeta Aggarwal) > Date: Mon, 24 Jul 1995 10:24:51 -0700 > Subject: Where can I get bread bags? > > I'm curious as to how others store their bread-machine bread. > I've been buying the large (one-gallon size?) ziploc bags but > the entire loaf doesn't fit very easily. Thus, I have to slice > the bread first and store it in two bags. Not terribly convenient. > Surely, there must be a place (mail-order perhaps) that sells > plastic bags sized for bread-machine loaves. Anyone know of such a > retailer? > > BTW, I've also tried using produce bags but they often are not > strong enough. > > Thanks, > Suneeta > > suneeta@tss.com > Instead of bags, I use a large, clear-ish, rectangular plastic cannister with a snap-on lid. It's big enough that I can place one and a half loaves of unsliced bread in it ... and being able to see through it lets me know when it's time to bake more bread without having to open it up (and let more air in) to check. I got it as part of a set of three at my grocery store ... I use the largest one for my bread, the middle-size one for my bread flour, and the small one for sugar. Debi Debi@Jobi.com "Never wake a sleeping toddler." - Debi Heiser, 1995 ------------------------------ From: kmdavis@netcom.com (Karen M. Davis) Date: Mon, 7 Aug 1995 20:26:02 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: Gluten-free help Phyllis Johnpoll asks: > [snip] more ways than one, since the person I was making it for is not only > unable to tolerate gluten, he can't have any soy, corn, or dairy > products. [snip] > He says he'll buy a bread machine if we can prove to him that it'll make > lots of different kinds of breads. Does anyone have a favourite > gluten-free recipe to share with me? The one I made was Mock Rye, and we > were able to handle the required substitutions (mostly for the non-fat > dry milk) ourselves, so you don't need to play with your own recipes. > > My friend and I thank you in advance. Best place to start is with Bette Hagman's books- the Gluten Free Gourmet and More from the Gluten Free Gourmet. Most of her recipes have workarounds for dairy, as well as being gluten-free. The second book ("More from...") has an even dozen bread recipes that are specifically made for bread machines (no conventional directions given). Between her two books, I've made challah (egg bread good enough to fool wheat-eaters), pumpernickel, cinnamon raisin bread (an adaptation of the tapioca bread recipe she has), mock rye, mock swedish rye, apple bread, french bread (great for sandwiches!) and a few others. If your friend must truly maintain a gluten-free lisfestyle, these books are "must-haves" - they take the pain out, since lots of replacement recipes are in there (incl. scones, pita bread and English muffins!) karen kmdavis@netcom.com (if urgent, use faigin@aero.org - the better half) Karen Davis of Davis and Associates (818)892-8555 "Pain is Mother Nature's way of telling us to slow down; Death is her way of INSISTING!" ------------------------------ From: Joel.Ehrlich@salata.com (Joel Ehrlich) Date: 02 Aug 95 06:16:06 -0700 Subject: You Might Be Interested In This I have been asked to forward the following message concerning rec.food.cooking and the current Call For Votes to the members of this list. Joel - - - - - - - - - Begin Forwarded Message - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - I sincerely apologize if the following somehow offends anyone. After a number of private email discussions with others who share this point of view, I've come to the conclusion that this is article is appropriate and deserving of some consideration. The CFV has been issued with little change from the RFDs; for whatever reason, the proponent has apparently not recognized the the clear and growing support for moving the proposed groups up to the rec.food hierarchy. Many discussions, both through postings and via email, have indicated that there is a large group of people who would prefer to see this happen. Given this, I'd like to make the voting population aware that should the rec.food.cooking.* groups fail in vote, at the earliest possible time afterwards, I will be issuing an RFD with the help of as many who would like to be included. The intent is that it should reflect the apparently wide support for leaving rec.food.cooking untouched while adding a few new groups to the rec.food hierarchy. Initially, it would seem as though at a minimum, rec.food.equipment and rec.food.marketplace should be included. While I have volunteered to take on this task, I'm not considering it on my own. This is already a group effort by some frequent users of rec.food.cooking et al, and I would expect it to continue to grow in number of proponents. If you feel that rec.food.cooking.(equipment,marketplace,...) is the right place for the group, then by all means vote YES for it. But if you think it belongs up in rec.food, be aware that if r.f.c. doesn't get split as a result of the current vote, there will be a proposal forthcoming to put these groups under rec.food. In earnest, - -dan - -- Dan Masi Mentor Graphics Corp. danm@warren.mentorg.com ------------------------------ End of bread-bakers-digest V6 #31 ********************************* bread-bakers-digest Monday, 14 August 1995 Volume 06 : Number 032 Today's Subjects: YEAST BISCUITS Bread Baker's Delight bread bags Another great recipe from Oster quick sourdough recipe Rye Bread of the Week no added fat breads "Faux" Sourdough Request - Digest V6 #31 Using a sponge technique for bread machines ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: ATMCDANIEL@ALPHA.NLU.EDU Date: Thu, 10 Aug 1995 9:23:25 -0500 (CDT) Subject: YEAST BISCUITS Anyone out there have a yeast biscuit recipe using the bread machine on the dough setting??? Nell ------------------------------ From: Deana Noelle Goldsmith Date: Tue, 8 Aug 1995 23:27:47 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Bread Baker's Delight How do I find a tupperware sales-person in my area in order to buy this Bread Baker's Delight tupperware thing? Please respond by e-mail to: dgold@uclink.berkeley.edu Thanks! Deana ------------------------------ From: tvasicek@watson.princeton.edu Date: Tue, 08 Aug 1995 06:58:54 EDT Subject: bread bags I use cereal bags to store my bread -- the huge bags that come in the giant, economy-sized boxes. They are even big enough for the four-pound monster loaves from my DAK Turbo-IV. These bags are very strong and impermiable to water and flavor. Just make sure the bread is COMPLETELY cool before you bag it. To seal, I carefully fold the open end and wrap the whole thing with a large rubber band. - -Tom Vasicek ------------------------------ From: Deana Noelle Goldsmith Date: Tue, 8 Aug 1995 23:26:10 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Another great recipe from Oster Another great recipe from Oster is their Multigrain Bread (I've been making this a lot lately: Multigrain Bread for Large Loaf (1 1/2 lb. loaf) 1 1/4 cups water 2 tblsp. margarine 1 1/3 cups bread machine flour 1 1/3 cups whole wheat flour 1 cup 7-grain cereal (find at health food stores) 3 tblsp. brown sugar 1 1/4 tsp. salt 3 tsp. regular active dry yeast or 2 1/2 quick acting active dry yeast Enjoy! Deana ------------------------------ From: Deana Noelle Goldsmith Date: Tue, 8 Aug 1995 23:20:54 -0700 (PDT) Subject: quick sourdough recipe Cheryl requested this bread recipe from the Oster bread machine cookbook so here it is: Quick Sourdough Bread Large Loaf (1 1/2 lb.) 1/2 cup plain nonfat yogurt 2/3 cup water 1 tblsp. lemon juice 1 tblsp. margarine or butter softened 3 1/4 cup Bread Machine Flour (Gold Medal Better for Bread flour) 1 tblsp. sugar 1 1/2 tsp. salt 3 tsp. regular active dry yeast or 2 3/4 tsp. bread machine yeast or quick acting dry yeast (They suggest using the French Bread for the Bread type if you have that option on your machine.) Hope that helps! Deana (first time posting here) ------------------------------ From: Elizabeth Schwartz Date: Sat, 12 Aug 1995 14:01:49 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Rye Bread of the Week One of the things I love about owning a bread machine is that you can "design" a loaf that is just perfect for you! I've been fiddling, trying to come up with our idea of the perfect sandwich bread. It should be: whole grain, wheat and rye, easy to slice, low-crumb, and low-fat, and of course taste great! Here's this week's recipe. It's getting close! It makes a firm, slightly sweet loaf with a small even crumb and a good rise. We have a big Oster bread machine with a whole wheat cycle; it's model 4812 style BB-100. Betsy's Rye Bread of the Week 1.25 cups water 1 Tbsp butter 1 Tbsp applesauce 2 Tbsp honey 1 tsp salt 2 cups whole wheat flour 1.5 cups rye flour 2.5 Tbsp whole wheat gluten 2 tsp yeast 2 tsp whole caraway seeds (optional) (ingredients in order of adding them to our machine) If you use whole wheat bread flour, use less gluten. Don't cut the salt much! For a higher loaf use 1 cup rye flour and 2.5 cups whole wheat flour. ------------------------------ From: Cherie Ambrosino Date: 8 Aug 95 11:26:11 EDT Subject: no added fat breads Hi Aaron, congrats on the weight loss! I do occassionally buy bread [yes I hang my head in shame!] but mostly I use the machine, [I have an R2D2 dak type which is no longer made, so I can't recommend one] and I have found a book that I think is just terrific for teaching about fat substitutes in baking. Its one of the nitty gritty cookbooks [they are about 4 by 8 inches - tiny paperbacks], The Bread Machine Cookbook [volume 3 or 4] on Whole Grains et al [it says whole grains on the cover] - if for some reason you can't find it e'mail me and I'll get the ISBN number from home. The book has lots of recipes for whole grain and sourdoughs and sprouted breads - but mostly I like it because many of the recipes either call for fat substitutes, like fruit juice , and tell you how much to use - but using it has also made me more aware of my choices in baking, whether its egg whites, skim or powdered nonfat milk, egg beaters, or juices and water, its been quite the eye opener for me! It also focuses on whole grain and bread with healthy things mixed in, which helps you get more nutriiton in each slice, which for me makes it easier to justify the added calorie intake after those "diet" [and tasteless!] store bought breads. She also gives a nutritional analysis of the loaves. She does discuss machines at the beginning of the book, so if you want to skim that before you purchase [actually maybe the best way is to skim that part of all the bread machine cookbooks - those authors usually have worked with several kinds] it might save you some heartaches later! Enjoy and good luck - Cherie ------------------------------ From: "SHERI K THOMASSON" Date: Wed, 09 Aug 95 08:50:44 cst Subject: "Faux" Sourdough Request - Digest V6 #31 Cheryl Taylor wrote: > Could someone out there with an Oster breadmaker please post the recipe > for quick "sourdough" bread that comes in that machine's cookbook? It uses > yogurt and lemon juice for the sour taste and is really easy. Plus you > don't have to plan ahead for starter to ferment. Thanks so much. Cheryl: I have a very good "faux" sourdough recipe that my family loves. It uses sour cream (can be non-fat) and vinegar (instead of yogurt and lemon juice). Think you might like to try it. "Faux" Sourdough 1 1/2 tsp Yeast 1/2 Cup Sour Cream (non-fat OK) 2 Cups Bread Flour 1 Tbls Vinegar 1 Tbls Sugar 1/2 Cup Milk 1/8 tsp Baking Soda All ingredients should be at room temperature before starting. Add the ingredients to the pan in the order listed. Select "White Bread". Press "Start". Another one that I recently concocted is my version of "Muffaletta" Bread. It is very much like sourdough and think you might like it too. I make it on the "dough" setting of my machine then cook in my oven. I'm sure it could be done completely in the machine if you want. Muffeletta Bread 1 c warm water 1 T sugar 1 pkg dry yeast (about 1 T) 3 c bread flour 1.5 t salt 2 T veg shortening Sesame seeds Form into round loaf 10" in diameter. On greased baking sheet. Sprinkle with seeds and press in. Cover with plastic. Rise 1 hour. Cook at 425 for 10 mins. Reduce to 375 and bake 25 mins. Happy Baking! Sheri T. ------------------------------ From: mark.stephens@gsfc.nasa.gov (mark stephens) Date: Mon, 14 Aug 1995 10:14:12 -0400 Subject: Using a sponge technique for bread machines We just got a breadman Plus a few months ago. While I'm happy with the ease of use I thought the texture of the white bread was a tad too course. So I tried making a sponge with the water, about 4oz of flour, 1 Tbs malt and yeast. Let rise 15min, pour in and add rest of ingredients. Worked like a charm. Very light and fluffy with even, small holes. Of course, don't try this with the timer! In moving to a more whole wheat bread, I've tried to use the same technique, but with the whole wheat setting. This has a 30 min rest before mixing the ingredients and lets the bread rise/rest three times. I let the sponge rise 15 min by choosing the WW setting ahead of time. The first two times I produced a really horrible yeasty, tasting brick! The yeast had gone to town and exhausted it's supply of sugar (malt in this case). Cutting back on the yeast, went from 2.5 tsp to 1, and not using any malt in the sponge helped. The bread still did not rise as much as I'd like but at least it tasted good. I do know that WW bread will not rise as much, but by half!? Any other folks try this sponge technique in a bread machine? Or am I just crazy and only think it's better (or worth the effort!)? Here's the recipe: 4 oz white bread flour 10 oz whole wheat flour 1 1/4 cup water 1 tsp yeast 1 Tbs malted milk 1/2 cup oats 2 Tbs powered milk 1 1/2 Tbs oil Preset machine to WW regular about 15 min before sponge is mixed. Sponge: Warm water, yeast (sprinkled on top, mixed in) with 4oz bread flour with about 1/4 cup ww flour. Pour into machines basket. Put in flour next followed by rest of ingredents. Rise time for sponge is about 15-20 min. The best WW bread I've ever made came from the Tasajera (sp?) Cookbook...those monks in California. They start with a sponge and let the bread rise four times. Great bread, but it takes a good chunk of the day to make. mark mark stephens "In constraint, NASA HQ, Code B, 8C57 is freedom" 300 E St. SW, Washington D.C., 20546-0001 (202) 358-2499 mark.stephens@gsfc.nasa.gov ------------------------------ End of bread-bakers-digest V6 #32 ********************************* bread-bakers-digest Saturday, 19 August 1995 Volume 06 : Number 033 Today's Subjects: Re: bread-bakers-digest V6 #32 Yeast Biscuits in Bread Machine?? Q: Varying Recipie Size Downward in a Bread Machine Baguettes doorstops ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ruth Greenwood Date: Mon, 14 Aug 1995 21:50:05 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: bread-bakers-digest V6 #32 Where can I find recipes that don't use dairy (butter, milk) or extra gluten? I don't mind wheat flour, but since my husband is allergic to gluten, I don't want our daughter to have more gluten than that found naturally in flour. Ruth ------------------------------ From: ATMCDANIEL@ALPHA.NLU.EDU Date: Wed, 16 Aug 1995 10:04:28 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Yeast Biscuits in Bread Machine?? I still have not received any recipes for the above...so, if everyone thinks someonelse has sent me one...wrong!! Please send if you have one. I have one that is not for the bread machine but I had to reduce the incredients and it just didn't work out!!! I love the "Faus" Sourdough recipe. Haven't tried it yet but will soon. One question...the recipe has no salt...isn't it the salt that activates the yeast?? Maybe not!! Nell ------------------------------ From: Aaron M Frankel Date: Mon, 14 Aug 1995 22:00:26 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Q: Varying Recipie Size Downward in a Bread Machine Hi bread makers, I recently got a toastmaster and I love it. I tried the basic french bread recipie and it was great. I made a loaf as a gift for my family (I am at school now) and they loved it. Only problem is even the 1 lb. loaf is more than I would want to eat in a day (well I might want to - but more than I should eat). How much can one vary the proportions of the bread. Could I make a half pound loaf by halving the ingredients? Would I need to change the bake setting? Should some ingredients (yeast?) not be reduced as much? Also what methods do you use to store the bread - How long do I need to let it cool before I can bag it? Thanks for the help ------------------------------ From: phyllis.johnpoll@ncsl.org (Phyllis Johnpoll) Date: Thu, 17 Aug 1995 18:54:13 GMT Subject: Baguettes A co-worker just announced that she loves bread, but hates bread machine bread. What she likes is crusty, french-style bread. Specifically, she asked for baguettes. I'm pretty confident in my ability to shape them, but don't have a trustworty recipe. Anyone have one I can try out? (I don't have ready access to sourdough starter, so it'll have to be a regular french or italian style loaf.) BTW, this time I remembered to back up one space before typing. Hope it comes across to the list intact! (I dislike this mail reader and I utterly detest our main mail reader. I can't win...) *BB* ptj _____________________________________ Duct tape is like the Force. It has a light side and a dark side, and it binds the universe together. ------------------------------ From: cbacke@lsumc.edu (Cheryl Backes) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 95 10:34:02 -0500 Subject: doorstops I bought a Breadman Plus last November and for several months (9, to be exact) was very unhappy with the quality of the loaves it turned out. Most of them rose well, then fell during the baking producing heavy loaves. I used the machine everyday and tried every remedy known to bread makers. The company insisted that there was nothing wrong with the machine. It seemed most likely that the moisture content was too high in my dough. I decreased the water drastically on all recipes; the dough seemed fine during the kneading process (nice, smooth, round, unsticky ball), but all of the loaves still were significantly undersized. Finally, I started weighing my flour (instead of measuring), and I stopped using the "regular" cycle on the machine. Now my loaves are consistent in texture and some are even pushing on the lid. I now use the "Fruit and Nut" cycle. It turns out that this cycle has a lower rising temperature (32C as opposed to 37C of the regular cycle). The entire cycle takes approximately 40 minutes longer than the regular cycle, but it is amazing to me that after all of these months and trials, I can finally make consistent bread. I write this in hopes that this will help anyone who is manufacturing doorstops in his/her bread machine. The weighing seems to be verry, verrrry important down here in New Orleans where the humidity is usually 80 - 100%. Also, the lower rise temp on the Breadman Plus seems to be important. Donna Rehberg (sp?) says in her book that she considers any cycle under 3 hours to be a rapid cycle (I guess that for the regular cylces on the Breadman Plus, one should use rapid rise yeast). Hope this helps someone who may be struggling as I did for several months. ------------------------------ End of bread-bakers-digest V6 #33 ********************************* bread-bakers-digest Sunday, 27 August 1995 Volume 06 : Number 034 Today's Subjects: Bread Making Machines Weighing Flour Re: doorstops Yeast Biscuits.... can't find a one! Bread List on Vacation Pillsbury bread-machine Sweet cycle for consistent bread in Seiko machines Dense bread recipes ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Marc W. Arnold" <75714.1615@compuserve.com> Date: 20 Aug 95 21:53:46 EDT Subject: Bread Making Machines Hello, My name is Kathy Arnold (am currently using my husband's e-mail address) and I'm new to the list. I would like to purchase a bread making machine but am lost as to what's the best choice for beginners. Any help would be much appreciated. Thanks in advance. Kathy Arnold ------------------------------ From: ah683@freenet.Buffalo.EDU (Rachel M. Gonsior) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:41:49 -0400 Subject: Weighing Flour I've read several posts regarding the benefits of weighing flour to be used in recipes. However, the book which came with my machine lists flour measurements in cups, not by weight. Several books which I consulted at the library also list ingredients by volume rather than by weight. Does anyone know how to convert recipes which use various kinds of flour? Thanks, Rachel - -- ------------------------------ From: Zhava Glaser Date: Sat, 19 Aug 1995 09:49:09 -0400 Subject: Re: doorstops On Sat, Aug 19, 1995 12:26:29 AM at owner-bread-bakers@blob.best.net wrote: >Finally, I started weighing my flour >(instead of measuring), and I stopped using the "regular" cycle on the >machine. Now my loaves are consistent in texture and some are even pushing >on the lid. I went out and bought a kitchen scale after reading several posts like this. Can someone post a basic "white" bread recipe by WEIGHT? Thanks! Zhava ------------------------------ From: Gunterman@eworld.com Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:33:20 -0700 Subject: Yeast Biscuits.... can't find a one! Ya know... I searched my entire recipie archive( nad it is HUGE) and could not find a single one! But, I'll keep my eyes out for oyu. John - ----------------------------- Begin Original Text - ----------------------------- Yeast Biscuits in Bread Machine?? I still have not received any recipes for the above...so, if everyone thinks someonelse has sent me one...wrong!! Please send if you have one. - ----------------------------- End Original Text ----------------------------- ------------------------------ From: reggie@reggie.com (Reggie Dwork) Date: Sun, 27 Aug 1995 21:43:04 -0700 Subject: Bread List on Vacation We will be away from our computer so the bread list will take a short vacation until the week end of Sept 16th. Please keep the bread machines running and keep the posts coming in. Sure would hate to come back and find that all of you have take the time off also and there is nothing in our inbox. See ya in a couple of weeks. Reggie and Jeff - -- Reggie & Jeff Dwork Owners, eat-lf mailing list and bread-bakers mailing list eat-lf-admin@reggie.com bread-bakers-admin@reggie.com ------------------------------ From: mpfachin@mat.ufrgs.br (Maria Paula Fachin) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:06:24 -0300 (GMT-0300) Subject: Pillsbury bread-machine Hi, I would like to know if anyone knows anything or have any experience with Pillsbury bread-machine. I have the possibility of buying it (we do not have many options here at good prices), but as I have not heard anything about this brand, I am a little bit afraid of investing a good amount of money on it. Also, my main reason for wanting a bread-machine is for baking wholemeal breads, so I would like to have insights on this issue as well. Thank you very much, Maria Paula ------------------------------ From: Julia Emerson Kiely Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 20:00:00 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Sweet cycle for consistent bread in Seiko machines Cheryl Backes found that the Fruit and Nut cycle gave the most consistent bread in her Breadman Plus. I had the exact same bread problems with my Chefmate, until I started baking everything on the Sweet cycle (this model does not have a Fruit and Nut setting.) "Basic" setting caused fallen bread, mushrooming, overcooked doorstops, etc. Then I looked it up, and found that Seiko makes both the Breadman and the Chefmate! It's probably the same machinery with different labeling and options. So the lower-temperature long cycle in the Seiko machines (whatever the label) appears to work most consistently. Julia Kiely eahu147@ea.oac.uci.edu ------------------------------ From: sherae@zeta.org.au (Sheri McRae) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 16:58:24 +1000 Subject: Dense bread I'm having a lot of trouble with very dense loaves of bread and was very interested in Cheryl Backes solutions to her dense bread problems. I agree that weighing is a much more exact process, but all my recipes are measured by volume. So, how do you know how much flour, etc. to use by weight. Any other suggestions on how to solve the problem of dense bread would be appreciated. My breadmaker is a Panasonic but I have a suspicion that it is different from the American Panasonic because I don't have a separate place to put the yeast. It just goes in along with everything else. We don't have bread flour in Australia, so I just guess at the amount of gluten to put in the flour. Maybe that's part of the trouble. Like Cheryl, I've been working on this for months. Wrong yeast? Too much liquid? Starter or buttermilk too thick? I don't know. Sheri McRae sherae@zeta.org.au Would the fans along the outfield please remove their clothes? - Public address announcer, Ebbets Field, New York ------------------------------ From: z@fybits.com (Z Pegasus) Date: Sat, 19 Aug 1995 21:17:14 Subject: recipes r@> From: Ruth Greenwood r@> gluten? I don't mind wheat flour, but since my husband is allergic to r@> gluten, I don't want our daughter to have more gluten than that found Ruth, I have several gluten-free recipes, and some info on a gluten-free list that may help you: If you find someone that is gluten intolerant we'd love to have them join the mailing list. It is at . To join, send a message to the listserver with SUB CELIAC yourfirstname yourlastname in the body of the message. - ------------------------------ a@> From: ATMCDANIEL@ALPHA.NLU.EDU a@> Subject: Yeast Biscuits in Bread Machine?? a@> I still have not received any recipes for the above...so, if everyone a@> thinks someonelse has sent me one...wrong!! Please send if you have one. a@> I have one that is not for the bread machine but I had to reduce the a@> incredients and it just didn't work out!!! Nell, Not sure exactly what you're looking for - here are a bunch of rolls, etc. for the bread machine. Bobbi z@fybits.com MMMMM----- Recipe via Meal-Master (tm) v8.02 Title: Dinner Rolls Categories: Machine, Rolls, Dough Yield: 12 servings 1 c Water; warm 1 Egg 3 tb Vegetable oil 3 tb Sugar 1 ts Salt 2 c Bread flour 1 c Multi-grain flour 1/3 c Dry milk powder 2 ts Active dry yeast Recipe by: The Bread Machine Cookbook V - ISBN 1-55867-093-9 Upon completion of the dough cycle, remove dough and form rolls, place on a greased baking sheet, cover with a towel and let rise in a warm, draft-free location for 30 to 40 mins. Bake in a preheated 400° oven for 15 to 18 mins. NOTES : Make your own multi-grain flour blend or buy a blend from a health food store or mail order catalog. MMMMM MMMMM----- Recipe via Meal-Master (tm) v8.02 Title: Hard Rolls Categories: Machine, Rolls, Dough Yield: 12 servings 1 1/4 c Water; warm 1 Egg white 1 tb Vegetable oil 1 tb Sugar 1 1/2 ts Salt 3 c Bread flour (up to 3 1/2 cup 2 ts Active dry yeast Recipe by: The Bread Machine Cookbook V - ISBN 1-55867-093-9 Upon completion of the dough cycle, remove dough. Form rolls, place on a greased baking sheet, cover with a towel and let rise in a warm, draft-free location for 30 to 40 mins. Bake in a preheated 400° oven for 12 to 15 mins. MMMMM MMMMM----- Recipe via Meal-Master (tm) v8.02 Title: Mom's Bread Rolls for the Bm Categories: Rolls, Machine, Dough Yield: 24 servings * JAN CARGILL ** VHPK03A 2/3 c Milk 2/3 c Water 1 1/3 tb Sugar 1/2 tb Salt 1 tb Shortening 1 pk Yeast or 1 env. dry yeast 3 c Flour Dissolve yeast in a 1/4 cup of lukewarm water. Combine milk,water,sugar ,salt and shortening. Stir until dissolved and lukewarm. Add yeast (dissolved in water). Sift flower (about 6 cups) only enough so you can knead it-(so it wont stick to fingers) for 10 Min.. Place in greased bowl and let rise (warm room) 1 1/2 hrs. (or until doubled in bulk) Punch down with knife and let rise again 1/2 hr. .Cut up in small pieces and roll around in hands and place in tin . (To form a small ball). Let rise for 1 1/4 hrs. (Put dough on floured board to work with). Bake in oven for 30 to 40 min at 350 degrees. Recipe from Marion Cargill of Island Pond, Vermont The ingredient amounts have been adjusted for the BREAD MACHINE. You will need to follow your bread machine directions for making the bread. The above directions are for BY HAND bread making only. MMMMM MMMMM----- Recipe via Meal-Master (tm) v8.02 Title: Tea Scones Categories: Diabetic, Fruits, Scones, Machine, Dough Yield: 8 servings MMMMM----------------------BASIC TEA SCONES--------------------------- 1 c Flour; 1 ts Baking powder; 1/4 ts Salt 1 tb Sugar Replacement; 1/4 c Margarine; cold 1 Egg 1/4 c Evaporated milk; -freeze the rest Stir one of the following Into the flour mixture for Tea Scones listed below MMMMM------------------------DRIED APPLE----------------------------- 8 Chopped apple halves; Food Exchange 1 STRACH/BREAD 1/4 FRUIT CAL: 44 MMMMM-----------------------DRIED APRICOT---------------------------- 8 Chopped apricot halves; Food Exchange 1 STARCH/BREAD 1 1/4 FRUIT CAL: 44 MMMMM-------------------------CRANBERRY------------------------------ 1/4 c Cranberry; chopped Food Exchange 1 STARCH/BREAD CAL: 34 MMMMM---------------------------DATES-------------------------------- 8 Chopped dates; Food Exchange 1 STARCH/BREAD 1/2 FRUIT CAL:54 MMMMM---------------------------LEMON-------------------------------- 1 tb Lemon peel; Food Exchange:1 STARCH/BREAD CAL: 34 MMMMM---------------------------ORANGE-------------------------------- 1 1/2 tb Orange peel; grated Food Exchange 1 STARCH/BREAD CAL: 34 MMMMM-----------------------DRIED PEACHES---------------------------- 8 Chopped peaches halves; Food Exchange 1 FRUIT 1/2 STARCH/BREAD CAl: 44 MMMMM--------------------------RAISINS------------------------------- 4 tb Raisins; Food Exchange 1 STARCH/BREAD 1/4 FRUIT CAL: 44 Sift flour, baking powder, salt and sugar replacement. Cut in cold margarine as for pie crust. Beat egg and evaporated milk together thoroughly; into flour mixture. Knead gently on lightly floured board. Divide the dough in half; roll each half into a circles. Cut the into quarters. Place on lightly greased cookie sheet. Brush tops with milk. Bake at 450f for 15 minutes or until done Food Exchange per serving of Basic Tea Scones: 1 STARCH/BREAD EXCHANGE CAL: 34 Source: The Complete Diabetic Cookbook by Mary Jane Finsand Brought to you and yours via Nancy O'Brion and her Meal-Master MMMMM MMMMM----- Recipe via Meal-Master (tm) v8.02 Title: Scottish Scones Categories: Diabetic, Scones, Machine, Dough Yield: 16 sweet ones 1 c Unbleached a-p flour;* -*a-p=all-purpose flour 1 c Whole-wheat flour; 1 ts Baking powder; 1/2 ts Salt; 4 tb Whipped butter; -(not me!! not on your life) 1 c Buttermilk; 1/2 c Golden raisins; Preheat oven to 400 degrees. Coat a baking sheet with non-stick cooking spray. In a medium-size bowl, sift dry ingredients together. Add butter, mixing into flour with your fingers. Add buttermilk and knead to a soft dough. Knead in raisins. On a floured board, roll out dough to 1/2" thick. Cut in 16 rounds. Place on a baking sheet and bake 15 to 20 minutes, until golden. Makes 16 scones. Food Exchanges per serving: 1 STARCH/BREAD EXCHANGE; CAL: 97; CHO:7mg; CAR: 3g; SOD: 3g; FAT: 3g;(If I gave the break down of the fat, I would be to pooped to pop) Source: Light & Easy Diabetes Cuisine by Betty Marks Brought to you and your via Nancy O'Brion and her Meal-Master MMMMM ------------------------------ End of bread-bakers-digest V6 #34 ********************************* bread-bakers-digest Sunday, 27 August 1995 Volume 06 : Number 035 Today's Subjects: Vegan recipes?? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: ba903@freenet.carleton.ca (Julia Gilbert) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 08:56:35 -0400 Subject: Vegan recipes?? Can anyone post or email me some vegan bread recipes? This would mean (for those who don't know) no milk, eggs, or any other animal by product. My friend also does not want sugar in the bread. Any suggestions would be helpful!! Thanks Julia ba903@FreeNet.Carleton.CA - -- Disobedience to conscience makes conscience blind. C.S. Lewis ------------------------------ End of bread-bakers-digest V6 #35 ********************************* bread-bakers-digest Tuesday, 19 September 1995 Volume 06 : Number 036 Today's Subjects: Bread list is back Re: Recipe by Weight Re: Recipe by Weight bread-bakers-digest V6 #35 bread machines Use of Quick-Rise Yeast Gluten Wonderslim Bagels Weighing Flour Vegan Bread Weighing flour Re: bread-bakers-digest V6 #34 Re: bread-bakers-digest V6 #34 Bread recipes by weight Vegetarian-Stuffed pizza Vegan Recipes Vegan Recipes Vegan, Sugar Free Bread Re: bread-bakers-digest V6 #35 dense bread ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jeff.Dwork Date: Mon, 18 Sep 1995 18:05:10 -0700 Subject: Bread list is back We have returned and so has the bread list. Thanks for your patience. A small reminder - please send messages for the list to: NOT to - that's for problems or questions for us, and not to - that's for the mail delivery system to tell us about problems with delivery. We get all these addresses, but the ones sent to bread-bakers are much easier to process. Thanks, Jeff & Reggie - -- Reggie & Jeff Dwork Owners, eat-lf mailing list and bread-bakers mailing list eat-lf-admin@reggie.com bread-bakers-admin@reggie.com ------------------------------ From: Stanley Goldstein Date: Mon, 28 Aug 1995 06:51:01 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: Recipe by Weight Basic weight formula: 2.5 lbs of flour to 3 cups of water. Stan Goldstein goldst@u.washington.edu ------------------------------ From: Stanley Goldstein Date: Mon, 28 Aug 1995 06:51:01 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: Recipe by Weight Basic weight formula: 2.5 lbs of flour to 3 cups of water. Stan Goldstein goldst@u.washington.edu ------------------------------ From: XEXU79A@prodigy.com (MRS ROBBIN A DICIACCO) Date: Wed, 30 Aug 1995 11:23:36 EDT Subject: bread-bakers-digest V6 #35 I am new at this, so please let me know if I am not replying to the right place. Julia, do you want ABM recipes or hand made recipes? Can they have soy products in them? ------------------------------ From: LoisCon@aol.com Date: Mon, 28 Aug 1995 19:18:32 -0400 Subject: bread machines Hi, I am the co-author of Bread Machine Magic and The Bread Machine Magic Book of Helpful Hints. I have a bread chat on AOL at 10PM Eastern time in the Kitchen Conference Room of the Cooking Cllub. I am available for problem solving at: LoisCon@AOL.com (???). I hope this gets to you... ------------------------------ From: Melanie Lawson Date: Thu, 7 Sep 95 08:59 EST Subject: Use of Quick-Rise Yeast Does anyone know if quick-rise yeast works as well as regular yeast in bread machines? Do any times or measurements need to be adjusted for it? Many of the loaves I make don't rise enough--think quick-rise yeast might help out? Thanks in advance for any advice! ------------------------------ From: arielle@taronga.com (Stephanie da Silva) Date: Wed, 30 Aug 1995 15:16:39 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Gluten Sheri McRae: > We don't have bread flour in Australia, so I just guess at the amount of > gluten to put in the flour. Maybe that's part of the trouble. You don't need much. A teaspoon or two is enough for 6 cups of flour. This is for hand-baked bread, I've never had the opportunity to try a bread machine. ------------------------------ From: sparky@ftp.netgate.net (Sally Eisenberg) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 1995 12:33:09 -0700 Subject: Wonderslim Hi All, I had listed some bread recipes this morning and I mentioned Wonderslim as a substitute for oil or butter. Wonderslim has no animal or dairy products and it's very low in sodium and is 99% fat free. There is also no cholesterol-perservatives. You can also use it to replace eggs in recipes for cookies and different breads, such as Peach bread,Zucchini bread. It can be used to make salad dressings. Wonderslim is only 35 calories a 1/4 cup. Sally Lou&Sally Eisenberg sparky@netgate.net ------------------------------ From: sdrennan@chat.carleton.ca (Steve Drennan) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 95 18:14:28 EDT Subject: Bagels I have a Black & Decker bread machine and it has a dough setting like most bread makers. Anyways, I am interested in making the dough to eventually make bagels, but not just any bagels. I once had CHERRY BAGELS and they were great but we can't seem to buy them anywhere. Does anyone have a solution to this frustration. Please e-mail me direct if possible to: sdrennan@chat.carleton.ca <------ Current address addicted@compmore.net <------ Future address Many thanks in advance! - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Mr. Steve Drennan - Mechanical Engineer '95 & Mrs. Jacinda Drennan - Sociology '94 Carleton University, Ottawa, Canada. ********************************************************** ** Duct Tape is Like The Force. It has a Light Side and ** ** a Dark Side and it binds the Universe Together !!! ** ********************************************************** Email address: sdrennan@chat.carleton.ca ------------------------------ From: aa122@detroit.freenet.org (John F Davis) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 1995 10:22:54 -0400 Subject: Weighing Flour ah683@freenet.Buffalo.EDU (Rachel M. Gonsior) Writes: >I've read several posts regarding the benefits of weighing flour to be >used in recipes. However, the book which came with my machine lists >flour measurements in cups, not by weight. Several books which I consulted >at the library also list ingredients by volume rather than by weight. >Does anyone know how to convert recipes which use various kinds of flour? Well.... The eaisest way is to put a mesureing cup on the scale and mesure how much lour weighs. Note it, bake the bread, and if it's perfect RECORD the weight. Keep using it. On the other hand if the bread looks like it needs a bit more or less, then expierment an ounce or two with the next loaf. By the way. I find that 2 cups is 10-12 ounces - -- John F Davis In Delightful Detroit, Mi. aa122@detroit.freenet.org "Nothing adds excitement to your life like something that is clearly none of your business!" Battista ------------------------------ From: "Ann Miner" Date: Mon, 28 Aug 1995 09:18:27 +0000 Subject: Vegan Bread > > Can anyone post or email me some vegan bread recipes? This would mean (for > those who don't know) no milk, eggs, or any other animal by product. My > friend also does not want sugar in the bread. Any suggestions would be > helpful!! > Thanks > Julia ba903@FreeNet.Carleton.CA Hi, Julia, You can take just about any bread recipe and substitute water (or soy milk) for the milk. Do you use Ener-G egg replacer? You can use it in breads (1 large egg = 3 T. water + 2 t. Ener-G). Many bread recipes don't even have eggs. For the sugar, you can substitute: honey (1 T. sugar - 2 t. honey) molasses (1 T. sugar = 4 t. molasses) fructose (1 T. sugar = heaping 1-1/2 t. fructose) Sucanet (equal measure for sugar) If you substitute prune puree or applesauce for the fat in a bread, you may be able to omit the sweetener completely. Most of this information was from Bread Machine Magic Book of Helpful Hints by Linda Rehberg & Lois Conway - a most handy reference tool. Good luck ... Ann ------------------------------ From: michelle.campbell@stonebow.otago.ac.nz (Michelle Campbell) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 1995 22:32:38 +1200 Subject: Weighing flour >From: ah683@freenet.Buffalo.EDU (Rachel M. Gonsior) >Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:41:49 -0400 >Subject: Weighing Flour > >I've read several posts regarding the benefits of weighing flour to be >used in recipes. However, the book which came with my machine lists >flour measurements in cups, not by weight. Several books which I consulted >at the library also list ingredients by volume rather than by weight. >Does anyone know how to convert recipes which use various kinds of flour? I only know the conversion for white flour, and even then only to metric. In metric, one cup is 250 mls; I think American cups are something like 237. One pound of flour is four metric cups. Miche - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Michelle Campbell michelle.campbell@stonebow.otago.ac.nz MY opinions, NOT theirs! "If I had been around when Rubens was painting, I would have been revered as a fabulous model. Kate Moss? Well, she would have been the paintbrush..." - Dawn French ------------------------------ From: Cdluria@aol.com Date: Mon, 28 Aug 1995 15:38:17 -0400 Subject: Re: bread-bakers-digest V6 #34 RE: Weighing flour, White Bread Recipe - by Weight: For Rachel et al.: In the controversy on weight vs. volume, the critical ingredient seems to be flour -- because its density can vary so greatly. KING ARTHUIR FLOUR CO. states that 1 cup SIFTED flour weighs 4 ozs. -- or 12 ozs. for the usual 3 cups called for by many 1-1/2 lb loaf recipes. But ABM recipes normally don't specify that the flour be SIFTED -- and that's where the great variation comes about. In our BREADMAN PLUS we get consistently good results using 14 ozs. of flour when 3 cups are called for. If your tap water is heavily chlorinated consider spring or distilled water. Our commercial ("packaged") yeasys are not affected by our water but the more fragile wild yeasts we employ for sour dough breads are very much affected. The BREADMAN gives a basic white bread recipe as follows: 1 1/8 cup (9 ozs.) Water 2 Tbl. Canola Oil 1 1/2 Tbl. Honey 3 cups (14 ozs.) Unbleached, All Purpose Flour (we find Bread flour works equally well). 3 Tbl. Powdered Milk 1 1/2 Tbl. Fine Sea Salt (we use regular salt) 2 tsp. Active Dry Yeast Carlos (cdluria@aol.com) ------------------------------ From: Rosanne Yostmeyer Date: Mon, 28 Aug 1995 07:02:26 -0700 Subject: Re: bread-bakers-digest V6 #34 >From: mpfachin@mat.ufrgs.br (Maria Paula Fachin) >Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:06:24 -0300 (GMT-0300) >Subject: Pillsbury bread-machine > >Hi, I would like to know if anyone knows anything or have any experience >with Pillsbury bread-machine. I have the possibility of buying it (we >do not have many options here at good prices), but as I have not heard >anything about this brand, I am a little bit afraid of investing a good >amount of money on it. > >Also, my main reason for wanting a bread-machine is for baking wholemeal >breads, so I would like to have insights on this issue as well. > >Thank you very much, > Maria Paula I have not responded to this list before, so I hope this comes out ok. I have a Pillsbury Bread Machine that makes up to 2 lb loaves. I love it, and have not had any problems with it. I have made all kinds of different breads including honey wheat, 7 grain, colonial, white, french, honey french and rye. Also I use the quick bread cycle all the time. I've had it about 7 months and have had no problems. I did however have problems when I tried to use gluten in my recipe. Don't know if it was the gluten, the recipe, or the operator, but I returned to using 1C white flour and 1C whole wheat flour. If you have any more questions you can mail me direct. Happy baking! Thanks, Rosanne ------------------------------ From: sherae@zeta.org.au (Sheri McRae) Date: Tue, 29 Aug 1995 18:31:13 +1000 Subject: Bread recipes by weight Found! A booklet of recipes by weight. Where the recipes say bread improver you'll probably just want to leave it out and use bread flour. If you want more of these recipes by weight, I'm happy to post some more. Haven't tried the white but have tried the Wholemeal and it was good. { Exported from MasterCook Mac } Basic White Loaf Recipe By: Serving Size: 1 Preparation Time: 0:00 Categories: White Amount Measure Ingredient Preparation Method 4 1/2 g yeast (1 1/2 tsp.) 300 g plain flour (2 cups) 10 g milk powder (1 tbsp.) 20 g sugar (1 tbsp.) 5 g salt (1/2 tsp.) 2 g bread improver (1/2 tsp.) 20 g butter (1 tbsp.) 220 ml water Bake: Rapid ----- { Exported from MasterCook Mac } Crusty Wholemeal Bread Recipe By: Serving Size: 1 Preparation Time: 0:00 Categories: Whole wheat Amount Measure Ingredient Preparation Method 4 1/2 g dry yeast (1 1/2 tsp.) 200 g wholemeal flour (1 1/3 cups) 100 g plain flour (2/3 cup) 10 g milk powder (1 tbsp.) 20 g sugar (1 tbsp.) 5 g salt (1 tsp.) 4 g bread improver (1 tsp.) 20 g butter (1 tbsp) 220 ml water Bake: Rapid ----- Sheri McRae sherae@zeta.org.au You always write it's bombing, bombing, bombing. It's not bombing, it's air support. _ U.S. Air Force Colonel D. Opfer, Cambodia, complaining to reporters ------------------------------ From: sparky@ftp.netgate.net (Sally Eisenberg) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 1995 09:03:54 -0700 Subject: Vegetarian-Stuffed pizza Hi All, This looked so good I wanted to share. Enjoy. * Exported from MasterCook II * Vegetarian-Stuffed Pizza Recipe By : Donna German Serving Size : 1 Preparation Time :0:00 Categories : Bread Machine Amount Measure Ingredient -- Preparation Method - -------- ------------ -------------------------------- 1 1/2 cups water -- warmed 2 Tablespoons olive oil 1 teaspoon salt 1 teaspoon sugar 1 cup whole wheat flour 2 1/3 cups bread flour 2 1/4 teaspoons yeast pizza sauce Filling 2 cups mozzarella cheese -- non-fat 1 cup broccoli flowerets 1 cup cauliflower flowerets 1 teaspoon oregano -- to taste Preheat oven to 375 degrees.F. Sprinkle a Pam sprayed pizza pan with 1 Tbs. cornmeal. Remove dough from machine. Roll 2/3 dough into 14-inch circle and place on a 12-inch pan. Mix together filling ingredients and spoon over dough, leaving a 2-inch border. Roll remaining dough into a14-inch circle and place on top. Fold edges over and crimp, sealing shut. Slit top with fork or sharp knofe in 4 or 5 places. Brush with pizza sauce on pizza, warm the rest and pour over baked pizza when serving. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - NOTES : You can replace olive oil with wonderslim to reduce fat. Lou&Sally Eisenberg sparky@netgate.net ------------------------------ From: Elizabeth Schwartz Date: Mon, 28 Aug 1995 09:15:26 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Vegan Recipes It's easy to make vegan bread. In any recipe, you can substitute your favorite vegetable oil for butter, or substitute applesauce for the oil. If you don't use *any* oil, the bread is more crumb-y, so using 1/2 oil and 1/2 applesauce is a good mix. We use 1 TBSP oil and 1 TBSP applesauce for 3 1/2 cups of flour in our large machine. You can also just leave out the egg, and substitute a TBSP of water or other liquid for each egg. There are also vegetarian egg substitutes; I don't know much about them but I think they are based on lecithin. Again, leaving out the egg makes the bread less 'cake-y' and makes it rise less. Whole wheat sandwhich bread doesn't need eggs, but cake-like breads (cinnamon bread, challah, fruit breads) will suffer a bit. Don't put too much extra weight (raisins, nuts, other stuff) into a bread without egg. A pinch of baking soda can help heavy breads, at some nutritional cost. Egg also helps "glue" the loaf together; breads with lots of mushy ingredients, like carrot bread, are most likely to suffer. We've made excellent banana bread without egg. You *can't* leave out sugar completely. The yeast *eats* the sugar which causes the bread to rise. You *can* substitute honey or sucanat (lightly processed natural brown sugar) instead of white sugar. You can also usually use about 1/2 the sugar that most recipes call . If you substitute honey for sugar, decrease the water in the recipe by about 1/2 the amount of honey (ie if you use two TBSP honey, instead of 1/4 cup white sugar, cut the water by 1 TBSP) Note: you'll have to experiment with quantities of water. ------------------------------ From: Elizabeth Schwartz Date: Mon, 28 Aug 1995 09:15:26 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Vegan Recipes It's easy to make vegan bread. In any recipe, you can substitute your favorite vegetable oil for butter, or substitute applesauce for the oil. If you don't use *any* oil, the bread is more crumb-y, so using 1/2 oil and 1/2 applesauce is a good mix. We use 1 TBSP oil and 1 TBSP applesauce for 3 1/2 cups of flour in our large machine. You can also just leave out the egg, and substitute a TBSP of water or other liquid for each egg. There are also vegetarian egg substitutes; I don't know much about them but I think they are based on lecithin. Again, leaving out the egg makes the bread less 'cake-y' and makes it rise less. Whole wheat sandwhich bread doesn't need eggs, but cake-like breads (cinnamon bread, challah, fruit breads) will suffer a bit. Don't put too much extra weight (raisins, nuts, other stuff) into a bread without egg. A pinch of baking soda can help heavy breads, at some nutritional cost. Egg also helps "glue" the loaf together; breads with lots of mushy ingredients, like carrot bread, are most likely to suffer. We've made excellent banana bread without egg. You *can't* leave out sugar completely. The yeast *eats* the sugar which causes the bread to rise. You *can* substitute honey or sucanat (lightly processed natural brown sugar) instead of white sugar. You can also usually use about 1/2 the sugar that most recipes call . If you substitute honey for sugar, decrease the water in the recipe by about 1/2 the amount of honey (ie if you use two TBSP honey, instead of 1/4 cup white sugar, cut the water by 1 TBSP) Note: you'll have to experiment with quantities of water. ------------------------------ From: Joel.Ehrlich@salata.com (Joel Ehrlich) Date: 28 Aug 95 08:31:07 -0700 Subject: Vegan, Sugar Free Bread ow> From: ba903@freenet.carleton.ca (Julia Gilbert) ow> Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 08:56:35 -0400 ow> Subject: Vegan recipes?? ow> Can anyone post or email me some vegan bread recipes? This would mean ow> (for those who don't know) no milk, eggs, or any other animal by ow> product. My friend also does not want sugar in the bread. Any ow> suggestions would be helpful!! ow> Thanks ow> Julia ba903@FreeNet.Carleton.CA This is as close to impossible as you can get without actually being there. Italian-style breads are made using only flour, yeast, salt, sugar and water. But, leave out the sugar and the yeast will have to start converting some of the gluten in the flour to sugar in order to grow and produce the gas which makes the bread rise. Real bread (as opposed to quick breads) uses yeat to make the bread rise. And yeast feeds on sugars. So, to have real bread (yeast bread), there must be some source of sugar for the yeast. Either we add it to the dough or we get what is known as a "rotten" dough. There's nothing wrong with a rotten dough, you simply have to add more gluten to the mix so that there'll be enough to form the "web" needed to hold the gas. But don't think that there'll be no sugar in that loaf of bread, the yeast will create what it needs from the gluten in the flour. What I'm saying is that there is no such thing as a sugar free bread. There are sugars in the flour. Here's a recipe for Italian bread. If you elect to leave out the sugar, add gluten so that your bread has at least some chance of rising, although it probably won't do it in the time period allowed by most bread machines. Italian Bread (ABM) No. 3187 Yields 1 Loaf 1 Cup Water 3 Cups Bread Flour 1 1/4 tsp Salt 2 1/2 tsp Yeast 1 tsp Sugar Add the ingredients to the pan in the order listed. Select "White Bread". Press "Start". Joel ------------------------------ From: sparky@ftp.netgate.net (Sally Eisenberg) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 1995 09:49:08 -0700 Subject: Re: bread-bakers-digest V6 #35 > >Can anyone post or email me some vegan bread recipes? This would mean (for >those who don't know) no milk, eggs, or any other animal by product. My >friend also does not want sugar in the bread. Any suggestions would be >helpful!! > Thanks > Julia ba903@FreeNet.Carleton.CA This bread you can leave out the margarine, by replacing it with Wonderslim. This is made with prunes mostly. Wonderslim is a fat replacement. The egg can be replaced by useing more water, licqued for licqued. As for the brown sugar just leave it out, I have done this with other bread recipes and had no problem. I don't like to use a lot of sugar in any of my recipes. I hope you can use this recipe with the changes that can be made . Don't be scared to experiment. * Exported from MasterCook II * Sweet Potato Bread Recipe By : Donna German Serving Size : 1 Preparation Time :0:00 Categories : Bread Machine Amount Measure Ingredient -- Preparation Method - -------- ------------ -------------------------------- 2/3 cup sweet potato -- cooked,yam 1 large egg water 3/4 teaspoon salt 1/3 teaspoon cinnamon 1/4 teaspoon nutmeg 1/4 teaspoon allspice 1/3 cup whole wheat flour 1 2/3 cups bread flour 1 teaspoon yeast 1 1/2 teaspoons margarine 1 1/2 tablespoons brown sugar 3 Tablespoons gluten flour Sweet potato, egg and water should equal 1 cup. Wonderslim can replace the margaine,to reduce fat. Egg Beaters can be used to replace the egg. The egg or Egg Beaters could be replaced with more water as long as 1 cup of wet ingredients is used. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - NOTES : Makes a 1 lb loaf. This is a very high rising bread. Lou&Sally Eisenberg sparky@netgate.net ------------------------------ From: sparky@ftp.netgate.net (Sally Eisenberg) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 1995 08:18:52 -0700 Subject: dense bread Hi All, I'm new to the list. About the dense bread, I have a Zojirushi Home Bakery bread machine. I have three freinds who measure the bread flour by volume as well as myself. We use gluten flour in our recipes. We use 3 Tablespoons no matter what size loaf of bread we are making. My bread is no longer dense. Also when measuring the bread flour into a measuring cup use a large spoon or a scoop to ladle the flour into the cup, this keeps the flour from being compacteded which can make the bread dense also. I also use Fleischmann's Bread Machine Yeast, found in the flour isle of the groery store. Once you open the jar you refrigerate it. Hope this will help with the heavey bread problem. * Exported from MasterCook II * Tangy Buttermilk Cheese Bread Recipe By : Rehberg & Conway Serving Size : 1 Preparation Time :0:00 Categories : Bread Machine Amount Measure Ingredient -- Preparation Method - -------- ------------ -------------------------------- 7/8 cup water 2 oz cheddar cheese extra sharp -- shredded 1 teaspoon salt 2 cups bread flour 3 Tablespoons dry buttermilk 1/2 teaspoon yeast 3 Tablespoons gluten flour Follow the instructions of your bread machine as to how the ingredients are to be placed in the pan. Makes a 1 lb loaf. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - NOTES : Dry buttermilk can be found in the